@irritalex: similar thoughts after watching... and the doctor who fell in love is, of course, complete trash. I really feel sorry for Gemma. I remember Irving with his "let's burn this place down." I hope they will be able to do this soon.
@mila52: the doctor is a psychologist, a guy in the room with postcards, it seems that he was still on the plane, and he was also in the basement, and he said bluntly that he liked her, and at the fertility clinic (a few years before the events, he had already noticed her). Well, actually, at Christmas, he confessed his Love and forced her to respond (this is most likely part of the plan, as in their last meeting with Mark, but he was serious). And in the psychology room, he repeatedly tried to hint that maybe you, Gemma, are also living a happy life somewhere in one of the rooms (with me, the doctor). And about Mark and the kids, why did he lie? And they also told him at the council that after the end of the project he would have to let her go, but he reluctantly nodded. (And he wore a reindeer sweater because it was a sweater from their love room.) Carriage of signs )) Although this does not negate the fact that he is still a sadist, and this love is very cruel and abnormal.
@Dimka_Elik: He talked about it even before Gemma's escape. And the escape was when a Milchik in a leather jacket and a motorcycle handled the situation with the innies turned on. And that was right after Mark's first kiss with Helly - before the bed scene for some time according to the timeline
@SpAwN_gUy: or a Cute guy in a leather jacket handled the situation with a book / card and a wallet - then before the first kiss. Or with the rest of the innies - then immediately after. It seems that they called him and called him back to the office - they just showed us what for.
@SpAwN_gUy: yes, in fact, it doesn't really matter when it was in the timeline. In fact, yes, it turns out he lied. You're right. Because Extra Mark is still looking for Gemma, but intro Mark had an office romance.) The most interesting thing is what kind of personality will turn out after reintegration. And how is Mark going to deal with such a dilemma? Is throwing a Helly working out?
@SpAwN_gUy: before her escape, the Doctor on the screen was looking at 96% of the Harbor, and this is after Milchik, who went home extra. And after a night in the tent, because there was 81% on the next working day.
@Dimka_Elik: It's also interesting.. Pusho is in love with Helly, there are 2-in-1's in love with Mark, and 1-in-a-Lot with Gemma. Or even wrong.. Helly is a 2b1b2 Brand, and Gemma is a 1-in-Many-in-1 brand. 🤔
@kaaat: I don't know if the doctor is in love with her, but I would like to point out that the Doctor, Milkshake, the little Asian girl, and Natalie are all very pleasant to look at, BUT at the same time very creepy. Their looks don't match their facial expressions.
What was that?! It's not the end of the season yet, but they've prepared such a gift for us! After so many years of waiting, we've finally been shown what's going on with Gemma! I wanted to catch every frame, every word in search of new clues. It was incredible! The next episode demonstrates the high budget of this season. One scene of Mark and Gemma's family life is worth it - the shooting, camera angles, scenery, music - well, just a delight for the ears and eyes! And what a touching moment with Gemma and Devon, when everything looks clear! And in parallel, this beautiful life story is intertwined with the horror that Gemma lives in Lumon! It is not completely clear whether she went there voluntarily or was forced to, but at least in the present she is already being held there by force. And she's got a few innies??? What a twist! I felt incredibly sorry for everyone, especially those who endlessly went to the dentist! You can't think of anything worse than torture! And Miss Casey, who just woke up and maybe felt something was wrong, but was brought up so submissive that she goes into this elevator, unknowingly betraying Gemma. What a drama!!! Oh, this episode needs to be watched in IMAX, it's so awesome!
@Fin: that's right, why are these series being filmed at all, you can outline the whole plot in a minute-long video and no stomping on the spot, just the essence. Context and character disclosure for the dumb.
@Fin: It seems to me that this series has never claimed to be fleeting. If you find fault and analyze each episode, then nothing really happens here, but this does not mean that it is not interesting to watch. The series can be hooked not by plot shifting, but by the game, music, camera work, and of course the answers to long-awaited questions. I don't know when you watched the first season, but many who watched it immediately after its release in 2022 have been building theories and guesses about Gemma for three years. And finally, a series where they don't just give us hints, but reveal many of the secrets of her disappearance. I think such an important character for the plot certainly deserves a separate episode. In any case, I'm not stabbing myself in the brain, unlike the main characters of the series. Pam-pam-pam!
@Fin: some time ago, I deduced an attribute for myself, which, in my opinion, is one of the rather accurate markers of below-average intelligence - this is the inability to try to understand and accept the diversity of other people's opinions, whether it's taste (in music, cinema, art), a position on any social or philosophical issue, field of activity, world view, etc. In other words, a person with such an attribute is prone to pathological rejection of anything that is not coplanar: people with a different opinion about art are labeled as having bad taste.; people with radically different interests enroll in geeks/autists or vice versa in a social network and so on. and so on. Hence the obscene "how did you like what I didn't like? Did you all get a SHOT in the BRAIN here?". From the same opera, by the way, the classic what did the author smoke?"#34; whom, I think, many have met. In truth, it's even a bit of a pity that the users above spent the time trying to consciously communicate with such an individual.
@leftcorner: imagine a lot of events that you can have an opinion about. In our case, this is an opinion about an episode of the series. In this case, opinions go beyond this set and form a new set derived from a set of events. But you can also have an opinion about an opinion. Thus, we already get a lot of opinions about opinions - let's call them second-order opinions (a similar thing can be observed, for example, with desires: desire of the first order - I want to sleep, desire of the second order - I want not to want to sleep).
The vast majority of users express first-order opinions in their comments. The user to whom I replied expresses a second-order opinion about those who broadcast a first-order opinion that is not similar to his own, and expresses it in an extremely offensive way, hinting at problems with cognitive functions, legal capacity, etc. Thus, my discussion with him lies on a different plane (2 order - 2 order) than his discussion (2 order - 1 order).
This is how I see this situation, and it doesn't follow from this description that I did anything similar to what the user I was responding to did. You can say that I insulted him too, but this statement is from a position of toothlessness and cowardice, since the actor of aggression always deserves a symmetrical reaction.
Snobbery? Maybe. I won't even deny it. This reminds me of a case about 10 years ago, in the comments on VKontakte, a lady began to aggressively assert the same thing to me (that I was a snob) because of... my use of the word cluster in the text is without comment. Maybe you were offended by the fact that someone has the ability to operate with vocabulary more extensive than yours and make up narratives without difficulty? Well, that's up to you. You can call me a snob and something else about stupidity, if that makes you feel better.
@id972349034: But this is called demagogy. Your long-winded explanation of "multiple opinions" and "narratives" is impressive, but unfortunately it doesn't make your position any less vulnerable. You're trying to justify your aggression by using complicated terms and second-order opinions. However, if you put aside all this verbal fog, the essence of your message boils down to a simple one: "I'm smarter than you, and you're shit." You talk about a symmetrical reaction, but at the same time you start with insults, hinting at the cognitive problems of others. This is not an argument — it's just an attempt to elevate yourself by humiliating others. Your comparison with the Vkontakte cluster only confirms that you like to play at intellectual superiority, even when it's inappropriate. By the way, snobbery is not about intelligence, but about the desire to appear superior to others. And your message is a prime example of this: instead of arguing on the merits, you hide behind complex constructions to hide the lack of real arguments. If it's so important to feel superior, please continue. Although, maybe instead of hiding behind complex constructions, you will try to explain why your opinion should be more important than someone else's? Or is this a third-order opinion that you forgot to mention? See, I can do that too. It doesn't change the essence. Aggression breeds aggression, and so on ad infinitum.
@leftcorner: Do you realize that you are now doing the same thing that you initially attributed to me? I'm smarter than you, and you're shit. So this is how you see this situation through the prism of your own thinking. You know what the joke is: You literally can't pass by when someone, in your opinion, is trying to appear taller than someone, and you're already trying to appear taller than them. You are the person you are describing in this situation.
My example about VKontakte, by the way, shows a variant of how a person with a wounded self-esteem is ready to see a manifestation of a snob, an upstart, and further down the list in any nonsense, and start trying to poke his nose into it so that he would be ashamed of such audacity.
And aggression, which, according to you, breeds aggression indefinitely, is not only direct insults or physical violence - our dialogue is also aggressive in its own way. Hence your desire to prove to me that I am worse than the user who insults everyone under this episode, coupled with the desire to stop aggression, it becomes schizophrenic.
@id972349034: You're making a mistake in your conclusions. I'm not belittling you in front of your opponent. In front of myself, too. You could just point out to him what he's wrong about, you don't have to INSULT him for that. However, you did exactly the same thing as he did, which is what I wrote about. You can't draw conclusions about intelligence based on little background information, like you do. Or maybe you even called me a schizophrenic just because you wanted to. In fact, I can now explain why you are the schizophrenic. But I won't. Once again, aggression breeds aggression. Think about it.
@leftcorner: if you had been more attentive, you would have noticed that I am not calling him a person with low intelligence, I am describing an attribute that he possesses (at least in this case), and which in my opinion is a fairly accurate marker of below-average intelligence. And I didn't call you schizophrenic, I called the intention you have in our dialogue schizophrenic, absurd, contradicting yourself in the moment.
You come in and, without any arguments, you insult me with that user in my manner of speaking, and you also call me a snob without arguments. When I explain in detail, chewing it out as if for a child, why this is not the case in my opinion, you call my arguments demagoguery and start clowning, allegedly parodying me.
Now you're saying that you can't draw conclusions based on small introductory statements, but at the same time you can safely draw conclusions about who I am from 1-2-3 messages))) Are you saying that your position is consistent and consistent? It's already really funny to me.
It turns out to be a kind of local fork of Hottentot ethics : You insult, and I denounce . You are a demagogue, and I am a born speaker. You are a p*** **s, and I am D'Artagnan.;
@leftcorner: Yes, it was funny)) he wrote such a sheet about the fact that everyone can have their own opinion, while shitting the opinion of another person who just didn't like the series. 😂😂
@leftcorner: why is his opponent wrong about something? He just expressed his opinion that he didn't like the series, or maybe the series, and has an absolute right to do so!) Who says it's right to love this series or series?)
@margafred: the episode was filmed just fucking well, but nothing is clear at all, how and when did it get there, it turns out it was split before Mark? Or was she imprisoned there after the accident?? But in any case, the whole style of the series fits me incredibly.
It's a very intense series. The life of Mark and Gemma before the events of the series is shown as in the best melodramas. I noticed that Dr. Mauer from Lumon was at the clinic where Gemma and Mark came. Why choose her for experiments? Why would she change her identity if she remembers Mark anyway and tries to escape?
@Flanker: I thought about the card that Dylan stole from the optics and design department, Gemma in one of the scenes looks at the same ones and writes down what she sees. It seems to me that this is a kind of Rorschach test, which is used to identify the most suitable person for experiments.
@Flanker: It seems to me that Mark and Gemma wanted to do IVF (possibly experimental), but they couldn't afford it, and Gemma agreed to some kind of research to pay for the procedure, or Lumen initially set a condition (the procedure in exchange for participation). For this corporation, in fact, the life of one person or a group of people is worthless, because they pursue higher goals.… Probably, the heroes just turned up handy.
In general, judging by the fact that we were shown four "substitutes" for the macro processing department (who seem to be similar to our heroes, but don't seem to be), it means that each of the heroes participates in some kind of experiments related to their relatives / acquaintances. Perhaps Dylan's children were born thanks to his work at Lumon, and his wife may also have participated in some experiments for the sake of this, but since Dylan is an executive guy and completed all projects at the time, his wife did not stay in this "clinic", and initially, apparently, she was on other terms. Irving was probably there because of his father. Well, with Mark and Gemma, they decided to conduct the most antisocial experiment possible (perhaps the doctor initially had a crush and advised the leadership to initiate the murder).
Ahhh, how much new information is there, how to digest it all? Devon and Regaby talk as if they've known each other for a long time. Gemma suddenly speaks Russian. All these rooms. Brains are boiling..
The plot is still unclear, but it was beautiful and sad at the same time. Gemma voiced my question to all the leaders of Lumon.
@Shtusha-Kutusha: I got the impression that they definitely don't know each other. It's just that both are punchy, so they don't crumple the boob, but they say/do it right away.
Damn it, right after the episode, I only have two questions.: what's going on there anyway (this one is rhetorical) and... how can Irving be connected to this lower floor???
Lumon is working on the possibility of dividing human consciousness by any means... Trouble? One of Gemma's personalities stays at the dentist forever, the other sits in the cabin of the plane forever... Obviously, she was selected for this experiment at the infertility clinic. Why does she sign postcards with her left hand, but fill out the questionnaire with her right?
@Shtusha-Kutusha: either there is a separate person in each room and a lefty is sitting in Allentown, or it's a bunch of unrelated innies that are formed in various stressful conditions, that is, she is forced to write with her left hand.
@KudasaiYo: I had a theory that was far-fetched. In the rooms, Inni is subjected to tremendous stress, the macrodata department erases negative memories, and reintegration is needed to combine all the accumulated experience in one person and the result is an incredibly strong psyche that can survive the introduction of another person's consciousness - in short, Lumon is trying to resurrect the dead in the bodies of living people or find a way for the Igans to live forever. But, goats don't fit in😆
@KudasaiYo: I think about the same thing. Gemma calls Chikhai Bardo the death of the Ego (and this answer, obviously, suits Lumon completely). Tolstoy's story "The Death of Ivan Ilyich" is mentioned twice, and he is also about Chikhai Bardo. That death ceases to exist the moment a person ceases to be afraid of death. All the innies of Gemma are struggling with their fears, with their egos. She doesn't remember how she overcomes the trials, but nevertheless she becomes... well, conditionally stronger and better. It improves it.
The Macro Science department is most likely CREATING these tests. Gemma visits the classrooms with the names of already completed projects. Cold Harbor will be for her- what? The final deadly obstacle? There she will have to overcome the fear of death.
Lumon is on the verge of inventing eternal life, and in their concept, a person needs to kill his ego for this. To tame temperaments.
It was as if I had even found a connection with these sinful goats. D A fainting breed was bred in the USA, intentionally with a genetic disease: during an attack of fear, the animal experiences temporary muscle paralysis, although it remains conscious. That's what goats are in the mammalian department, it seems to me...
@Shtusha-Kutusha: Parks and recreation areas are a must-watch, many people don't like the first season, but it's short, starting with the second season, it's a masterpiece at the Office level.
@KudasaiYo: When you write with your left hand, the right hemisphere develops. The left one is responsible for logic, analysis and calculation, while the right one is responsible for emotions and intuition.
@Shtusha-Kutusha: It is possible that it is easier for scientists to overcome the ego of a goat than a human. And then put Cyrus Egan in her body) Perhaps such experiments are already underway, and Gemma is the first potential human candidate for the introduction of another consciousness?
@Slice_of_nice: I'm sure there are people who collect other people's thoughts from everywhere and pass them off as their own, but I don't have that much to do)
@Shtusha-Kutusha: Devon also mentioned some kind of Birthing center, I either don't remember what it is, or is it a place where women are separated during childbirth, only for Inni to give birth?
@ann_i_am: Right. When Devon herself was giving birth, she went to the neighboring house for coffee and met a girl there, the senator's wife. The senator's wife underwent a separation procedure to give birth. That is, it can be assumed that people with a chip in their brain in this house will switch to innies.
@Shtusha-Kutusha: we were shown that technology can be turned on remotely (overtime mode), ignored (Hello, and also remotely), set to zones (and not two-dimensional, but three-dimensional. Like on the -1 floor, but not on -2) and even on the passage through the door (or there is also 3d for each test room). Here I think it's still 3d + remote. Then he explains how Inni only woke up in the forest, and Jamma was on the plane. And "remotely " then they can simply turn on small 3d at the right coordinates.
@SpAwN_gUy: switches in doors and elevators. Back in the first season, Helly tried to leave through the door and Helena brought her back, there is no 3d, 2d. It's switched remotely from the outside.
@wtchr: Irving's black corridor leads only down (even deeper underground), to go up you need an elevator up. And we've already been shown this black corridor twice, when an employee came down from the divided floor with dental instruments in previous episodes, and when Gemma ran away and took the elevator, she switched to Miss Casey and met Milchek in a leather jacket in this black corridor (he wouldn't let her go to the divided floor).
So you can't go outside, only down and the switch will work in the opposite direction. At the same time, the inns from the divided floor will become their own external ones.
This series can be shown as a horror movie. I'm just in shock. It turns out that versions like "Gemma really died and only her innie exists" were still a pleasant option, but in fact everything is a million times worse. Lumon DELIBERATELY ruined people's lives for the sake of experimentation. Gemma is sitting on the torture floor with a pervert doctor and can't even escape because of the switches. And he's still trying to convince her that Mark got married again and has a daughter???? fucked up..........
@Shtusha-Kutusha: maybe!! considering how many episodes are left, I hope that they will at least have time to find her before the end of the season. Gemma's rescue will probably be dealt with in the third one.
@lozzly: and on a plane with turbulence, and filling out cards for Christmas with some creep guy... and this has not yet been shown to the other rooms, where there is also game. And this happens all the time for her inni, and Gemma herself visits 6 rooms every day. There are no words, Lumon is just an evil empire, all these Dogs, Milchek, Helena and so on are interesting characters, but for this they, like the rest involved in this story, I hope they get what they deserve.
If we consider that one of the main lines of the series is the cult around and within a huge corporation, then one could assume that Lumon is on the verge of a truly important discovery that would change the lives of mankind for the better. Not a cure for cancer, but something like that. Perhaps, in the end, we will face an ethical question: if we did not know the history of the Brand, but simply received this medicine, would we think about possible sacrifices on the way to its invention? It's creepy.
@Shtusha-Kutusha: Yes, not bad. Imagine: you take a pill, and when you enter a room (possibly equipped with a special device at the entrance), you separate. How much stress it would have saved.
Like anesthesia, only for those cases when you need to be conscious. Well, most of those who split up from you won't even think about it — you weren't one of them.
@kraleona: Probably the one where a clone of her for a "smart home" was created for a rich woman. This clone also had a soul, and she was also tortured, locked up for days, days, and years in a small box for obedience. I don't remember where it was. Most likely, "White Christmas".
@Shtusha-Kutusha: Kurt Vonenguth wrote that no matter what scientists invent, they always get weapons, and here, first of all, it is an opportunity to create universal soldiers.
Does anyone have any ideas about the macro processing department tracking department? The first time they're shown to us, there are four of them, each like a double of our heroes (more doppelgangers). But the second time, no one is sitting at one of the computers. This happens during Mark's nosebleed, meaning the surveillance officer dropped out with Irving.
I also noticed that Mark mentions from his memoirs that Gemma hates writing thank-you letters. :( The series is simply incredible in every way, but first of all, it is incredibly beautifully shot.
@Shtusha-Kutusha: then it adds up to a picture as if she is being deliberately chased through rooms where something particularly sensitive is happening for her, perhaps her original personality has aerophobia and fear of dentists
I expected a lot more from the plot, but in the end we were shown what we already knew.
a couple of interesting points: 1. Mark is innocent of Gemma's death, which is a good thing. 2. unexpectedly, it is divided into so many parts that are not related to each other in any way. 3. The dude who confesses his love to her probably really loves her. 4. The series is visually just sweet, all these creative transitions, colors, stylization of flashbacks for film (or shooting on film itself), all this caused me a puppy delight. 5. Devon?? Is everything OK?? About yourself at all?? Who should I call??
@malaxitos: the series will sparkle with new colors for you when you find out that the dude who confesses his love is a doctor who drills his teeth, as well as conducts sessions as a psychologist) He was also in the center with 4 observers in the basement.
@malaxitos: in the video after the credits, they say that their main cinematographer was the director of this series. It explains a lot, and I'm also excited about flashbacks. Especially the dinner scene — it feels like I'm in Annie Hall.)
And Devon was freaking out, yes. We seemed to be communicating normally, and then she was like, "I'm going to call an angry woman," and she was kind of shocked after that that the doctor was leaving her, running away in fear.
Neither school, nor a bunch of film adaptations of Tolstoy's novels forced me to read this tedious stuff. And then, as they say, Tolstoy crept up unnoticed. Now I'm sitting with a book, delving into how that fucking Ivan Ilyich died in order to figure out what this sad and impressive series is about.
I can't get away from the thought that in the TV series "Pose" Sandra Bernhard played a nurse and took gay people with AIDS to offices and didn't let them die, and here she... plays a nurse and takes poor Gemma to offices where she is TORTURED, but, really, she doesn't let her die. 😅
I already exhaled that Mark was sitting at home that ill-fated night, otherwise the theories had already gone to the theories of the fans of "Separation"…
Again, it's not clear how to wait a week, there are more and more thoughts and questions, we need to review the series again.
@dart93: "and not the fact that" Dichen Luckman (Gemma) played in Joss Whedon's Dollhouse, where her personality was uploaded to a hard drive and random personalities were uploaded into pure consciousness as needed: today you are a super agent with knowledge of karate, tomorrow a whore, the day after tomorrow a murderer, on Thursday a doctor…
Once again, we're watching a little movie inside the series.😍 And the caste in the Division is really brilliant. I was so touched by the actress playing the role of Gemma, just to the point of tears... The series made me reflect, and that's what I'm going to do.
Whoa whoa whoa... Did they really start giving us answers on the sly? My personal conclusions: 1) Mark and Gemma wanted a baby; miscarriage, talks about adoption, tests in clinics, frustration 2) Gemma gets something from the Lumon Clinic in the mail (isn't that their card she's looking at?) 3) Gemma goes out somewhere in the evening, she is abducted (?) Lumon and make it look like an accident? 4) then they keep her locked up from the rest of the world, separate her, and experiment on her in different rooms. At the same time, they lie about Mark and what's going on. 5) It's creepy, but she's been separated so many times that she doesn't remember what's going on in different rooms... What if there is a multi-level division, like an inni within an inni? 6) It's still unclear why they're doing all this to Gemma. What is Lumon trying to create?
We were shown all these rooms - Allentown, Cairns, Dranesville, Siena, Loveland, Tumwater, Adelaiade, Sopchoppy, Rhodes, Cold Harbor. They're the names of the projects in the folders. These are all names of some cities or places, which in itself does not mean anything. Wellington (and number 23) is a dentist, as we were shown.
what is Denali (Gemma asks Mark about it before she leaves that evening)?
Interestingly, they said about Kobell - she was raised by them, so is there still some kind of employee education program?
And finally, a wild idea arose - what do the projects themselves mean nothing? It's just that Gemma is taken through different superstress situations to test the cognitive load of her various inns to determine the reliability of the separation procedure. And the macro data processing department processes the results of these very tests.
P.S. I really like the film filter that highlights flashbacks. It's nice to look at such a picture. A clip from a happy movie about the beginning of their relationship is generally a delight to the eyes. You don't often see such beauty even on the big screen.
@colorer: I can answer at least one question)) Denali is a national park in Alaska. Gemma was probably planning a vacation similar to what Devon and Ricken had told them at lunch.
@colorer: They said about the dog "she was raised by them" because she was at Myrtle Egan girls' school. As I understand it, they are already beginning to brainwash them there specifically for further work on Lumon.
@colorer: The MDR was 96% decrypted by Cold Harbor, and Gemma had never been in that room before. It turns out that MDR completes the project first, then Gemma can gain experience in the room.
@colorer: in my opinion, an inni within an inni is impossible. Inni is not inside the extra at all, he is separate from the extra. Gemma just has a lot of separate personalities. The only difference is that whoever walks down the corridor knows about the inni's existence, about the switch. And those who are in the rooms may not know, because they are always in the room. But yes, if the rooms were behind each other instead of across the corridor, the mb innies would immediately switch to other innies. But the concept seems to be that there should be only one person with at least some control over the situation.
It turns out that Gemma is divided into n-th number of parts, an interesting twist. The feeling that the man she hit with a chair at the end is obsessed with her. The episode was shot just unrealistically beautifully.
It's a wonderful series in terms of shooting and plot, so many answers (and new questions), but the feeling after it is quite unpleasant. That is, all this time Gemma was just downstairs, experiments were being carried out on her, and she is exactly the Gemma who dreams of returning to Mark (the scene at the end with Ms Casey and in the lobby and Gemma in the elevator is a pain). I didn't fully believe that Gemma (with her memory) was alive, so I was shocked when the whole story was shown. The whole deception of how she was lured, the accident was set up, and then her husband was involved is just a tin can. And now they are also forced to go through such hell - most likely just to test the chip (maybe they want to go into mass production?), because all the rooms have some unpleasant moments / fears, and the last Cold Harbor is probably with the fear of death (and there may even be a moment with drowning / suffocation, which the doctor mentioned). And the worst thing is that Gemma is being talked about as material that will be disposed of after the completion of the project (even in this series there are so many hints about this), so it's scary that there may not be a happy ending and Gemma and Mark will never see each other, or there will be some kind of catch.
And it turns out Gemma is on the lower floor of the outty, each room has a separate inny, on the divided Ms Casey, I wonder if when she goes upstairs she will be Gemma or there will also be a twist. That is, if Helly had got to the lower floor, Helena would have been there and it wouldn't have helped Mark, or if he had gotten to the reintegration himself, he wouldn't have really figured it out either. And now, having been reintegrated, there are chances to save her by being at the bottom, or at least not to bring her to 100% Cold Harbor.
In general, I hope Mark will somehow stop this process, it was clear that Lumon had completely gone, but after this series he was shocked by these people. The doctor who told Gemma that Mark got married and had a daughter - it's not enough to knock him with a chair, plus these employees who monitor the project... I really hope there won't be a 100% completion rate. Oh, in general, the series is amazing, despite everything that happens in it, I wonder what will happen next, and what the reintegrated Mark will do.
P.S. I'll also mention Devon in the series - before that I thought she was the most rational character, but then I was surprised. Should I call a dog?? Seriously?
@kobiii: pts, it feels so bad if Mark is working on Cold Harbor, and when he completes it, she will be separated in that room, and Inni will be sent to her death (A potential favor so that auty himself does not worry about death..? like with the pregnancy in the last episode. No wonder they remembered in this one.)
It's clear that the whole division revolves around the metaphor of death (Innie Irving), but there was a bold hint in this episode, too, when Milkshake sent the reborn Miss Casey back into the elevator without answering a single question. Rough.
@pinta_vodki: now I realized that Gemma, like Miss Casey, turned on for half an hour because she was on the floor and automatically turned on. We already thought she had a computer or was being chained up. Well, a computer is better than groundhog Day.
@kobiii: Yes, as if Cold Harbor is an episode of death, staging, possibly drowning (cold harbor = cold harbor), Gemma drowned. We still don't know if it was a setup or if she was actually drowning, maybe she was saved, and then something happened with body substitution, staged death, etc.
@Victorry: he said "I've seen her body burnt", which can be interpreted in two ways, and we recently saw ashes in the second season. So it's like she was cremated.
As a historian, the series left me with a residue of memories of Nazi Germany. Lumen is Bayer, Gemma is a prisoner who is being experimented on. The doctor is one of the many Nazi doctors with the face of a "true Aryan," a concentration camp nurse, a good type. It's a pity that Milchik is still a Lumen six, I hoped to the last that he was normal. Seriously, Devon? Should I call a dog? And I would also like to admire the beauty of the series, the moments of joy in the life of Mark and Gemma were reminiscent of the movie "Man and Woman", so much tenderness in every frame.
@KatrinVamp: firstly, Gemma is through M, and secondly, which is better: to try all the options or regret later for the rest of my life that I didn't try? I didn't see Mark's depression before Gemma disappeared - just a man immersed in his work with his head, and of course he is also upset because of his wife's failures / sadness. But when she "died" - he started drinking, sleeping poorly, wandering aimlessly around the house, leading a closed lifestyle - these are signs of real depression.
@KatrinVamp: And I agree that Mark behaved like an asshole, especially when he was breaking something. No, to support Gemma and help her take her mind off sad thoughts, he put his suffering above everything else.
@voronrun: yes, he didn't break it, he was trying to assemble this crib, but, as Gemma suspected, he really has hands out of his ass... It doesn't happen to anyone
@kaaat: It doesn't affect your comment much, but I think Mark was drunk when he broke the crib and Gemma was crying on the stairs. (That is, he started drinking after the miscarriage, and not after the loss of his wife).
@cherik-cherik: not to assemble, but on the contrary to disassemble ... this is the drama that this moment is shown as the extreme point of despair, they gave up. He's trying to take the crib apart, and Gemma hears it and flinches.
@KatrinVamp: perhaps she wasn't initially fixated on having a baby, but the miscarriage traumatized her so much that it affected her thinking and psyche in general.
@KatrinVamp: I agree, Gemma and Mark had a wonderful life - a beloved partner, an inspiring teaching job, a home, intimate dinners with relatives... well, that's why there must be a child, what kind of fixation on children in general, as if life without a child is somehow incomplete and not happy
Tin Milkshake had a busy night. Not only was he solving problems with our guys, but Gemma was also trying to escape. He's already out of breath, how could he not freak out (even though he's already on the verge)
Damn, I was watching with one eye, against the background of work. I couldn't wait for the evening. Now we have to review it, because the series is crazy, touching, and sad, and the visual is unreal.
How handsome Mark is in the flashbacks with Gemma, and how fucked up and ten years older he is in real time. Bravo to the makeup artists and lighting designers.
More about the people from the surveillance department. Judging by this season, they had a good rest while our guys were walking in the park, going to the goats and figuring things out (yeah, it's the nosebleed that prevents Mark from working)
But Miss Casey in the hallway didn't remember anything at all about the rooms downstairs, is she even a different person? Does she have her own personality and backstory for each room? She doesn't spend much time there, so she needs some kind of motivation to write these hateful letters.
I'm absolutely thrilled with how stunningly shot this episode is, and how incredibly light and color are used in this series. Sunlight as a metaphor for love is great. The scenes from before, shot on warm grainy film, in the same retro style as the divided office, but with the exact opposite atmosphere, are brilliant. Cold colors and darkness as a metaphor for coldness and despair are mind—blowing. For the first time, spring/summer was shown only in the world where Gemma was, and which, as in the myth of Persephone, seemed to turn into eternal winter when she went to the underworld of Lumon — wonderful, amazing, wonderful
In the story, the doctor worked at the reproductive clinic that Gemma visited. I didn't get the impression that she was abducted, so I think she really died in a car accident and her body was stolen from the morgue (maybe there was some fine print in the contract of this clinic that allows them to do this, and she technically agreed to it that's all).
Does it seem like Inni Gemma is turned on anew in every new room? Are they testing the limit of personalities that can be crammed into one person? There was a theory that Gemma's real identity was being restored with the help of Cold Harbor, which turns out to be untrue since she remembers Mark, but now it's even more unclear what he was doing then. Is he creating a situation so traumatic that she can remember it even outside of separation?
I love that Gemma also ends up trying to escape (it's absolutely heartbreaking how her Boyfriend turns her back on), and how we were told that the first time she tried to bite off the doctor's fingers was yet another feral girl representation from severance. To be honest, the actress seems to have a lot of botox, because her facial expressions are very plastic, and the emotional moments are quite flat from this. But on the whole, I'm very glad that they finally paid attention to her, too, and we saw what she really was like.
@cherik-cherik: > Spring/summer is only in the world where Gemma was, and which, as in the myth of Persephone, seemed to turn into eternal winter when she went to the underworld of Lumon
MY DISMISSAL...
Is he creating a situation so traumatic that she will be able to remember it even beyond separation?
According to numerous references, there is either a situation of death through inni, or something as close as possible to this without real death, or the death of inni's ego in order to use this body for something else. As in the elevator scene, Milchik is basically like this: "Don't ask unnecessary questions, go back to oblivion."
Somehow, everything turned gloomy. To think that a few episodes ago, people here were discussing Mark's navel height))
@cherik-cherik: on the topic of Greek mythology: I recently read about the comparison of Mark with Orpheus, who descended into hell for his dead wife, and was promised to bring her back alive if only he could walk all the way up without turning around, but who nevertheless turned around at the very last moment when he was overcome by doubts about whether she really was follows him. it would be just wildly cruel if Gemma really plans to be released after the completion of Cold Harbor (in what condition, however, is unclear), but Mark will not be able to complete the project due to reintegration, and Gemma will remain a hostage forever.
@captain_wood: It's unlikely that the corporation that has been forcibly imprisoning Gemma for years and experimenting on her is planning to just let her go.
@_Jackdaw_: in one interpretation of the myth of Orpheus and Eurydice, it was also hinted that the gods never planned to let Eurydice go, they simply tortured Orpheus ((in any case, a very sad comparison
@Nimfa_Katarina: Did it burn down? We were told that Mark saw a burnt body, it could belong to anyone. And after this episode, it's already clear that the accident is a staged Lumens.
Thought If these rooms are an experience that people would like to get rid of by dividing themselves, as in the case of a woman who divided herself for the birth of a child, then cold Harbor is like the last room...Is it an experience of death? That's why she's the last one, that's why they promise to release her (they don't promise that she's alive), and in general, she's already dead in the outside world.
Horror mixed with melodrama is such an attraction of emotions rarely seen on the screen... I feel terribly sorry for Gemma. The dramatic change in Mark's appearance is very revealing. We need to burn this place down.
The series is a dump of everything. A real work of art... How it's written, how it's shot, how it's played. And the music is touching.
They say the record for holding your breath is 24 minutes 37 seconds. How do you explain the fact that I haven't breathed in all these 50 minutes? Mmm?
This episode of "Separation" is the best I've seen in recent years in a series format. These spectacular transitions into the past, the personal pain of the characters, the feeling of being unable to roll everything back – it's just brilliant. At some point, it seemed that his wife got there because she couldn't get over the loss of her child, and he followed, because he couldn't get over her loss.
I also liked the moment where she walks through a metaphorical tunnel with a light at the end. But Milchik doesn't let her get there, asking her to come back. And when she returns, she finds herself with a double exposure in Mark's head. Incredibly strong work with visual language.
There is so much personal here, so much pain. It's been a long time since I've felt such strong emotions from TV series, probably since the days of "Heirs".
Of course, Devon doesn't have the stamina for everyone - an unknown woman who doesn't even really answer the question of whether she's a doctor drilled her brother's head and fell into the fog, and her sister relatively calmly endures the night on duty, instead of running on the ceiling and calling 911. It's clear that she doesn't trust Lumon, she's afraid that they'll find out It will hurt Mark, but sitting out the night like that with a brother who doesn't know what's going on is really nerves of steel.
The shot where Mark desperately does not want to open the door to the police, realizing what they will say. And at the same time, Gemma, realizing in despair that she has returned back to the horror floor, is just really, really punchy.
@Anaksana: Devon instinctively trusted Regaby, because Mark trusted her.And Regabi said we need to wait it out. And there is no choice, it is clear that on the other hand, there is a Lumen everywhere.
How sorry is Gemma? After this episode, the gray morality of Lumon, if one could even think about it, disappears and only the desire to punish them all remains!
Such a beautiful series, so unusual compared to the previous one, where there was a lot of white background, contrasting dark colors (blue, green) on a white background, everything is so cold.
And here there are such warm shades of spring or autumn, flowers, life is in full swing! Nice to see. And you realize what Lumon did to their lives. He turned it into a personal hell for the autie and arranges death or die trials for the intr.
Gemma remembers Mark, she wants to go to him, she's not a clone! What a relief and at the same time very sad for them that everything is like this. If Hayley gets pregnant now, things will get a lot more complicated. I hope not...
"what is this in very good Russian from Gemma with almost no accent was very surprising (in a good way), despite the fact that there is an explanation for this
It turns out that Lumon has been around since Mark and Gemma met. Even when they first speak during blood donation, the logo on the equipment is in the form of a drop. In the reproductive clinic, their sign is also on the questionnaire, of course. Not to mention the maniac doctor who works there. Maybe it's all a tricky multi-pass from the very beginning?
Very beautiful film flashbacks, of course. And rewind the frames of the happy past to the "Waltz in a thousand quarters" by Jacques Brel
And the death of Ivan Ilyich, of course. The story is about doom, impotence, and the fact that everyone dies alone, because healthy people don't understand, it's awkward, and they want to move on. It's a creepy thing, actually-and it's scary that the scriptwriters clearly associate Gemma's story with it.
@CastielFreed: reading such comments, it seems that some viewers want Mark to take a bazooka and go smash Lumen's offices in the spirit of the Punisher. Well, to give Daredevil a peek, we want to advertise the new season.
What kind of expectations do you have to have to write this? x) You give people excellent cinematography, incredible emotions of the actors, riddles, ENT for 50 minutes, finally, and they write black, some information on zeros.
There is more information than in many previous episodes, where the emphasis was on dialogues. They revealed Gemma's character, showed her and GG's past, showed where and what she is now (I haven't seen her all season), how she tries to escape, and showed how Lumen works... Is it too little??? Well, I don't even know. It's full in just 50 minutes, like a full-fledged mini-movie.
@Mr_Knight: cons, cons, and the previous uninformative series could be analyzed frame-by-frame, looking for symbolism and micro hints, and then the possible interpretations were piled up. For example, the department that monitors the OMD, why are they so similar? Are they even human? What exactly are they doing? So maybe they're just doing the chip's job, manually preventing the separated personalities from reuniting? (well, that's what I had a thought) But why did they take blood from the overseer when she let Gemma into the room? You can also pile up versions, and so on for each new location/character.
@Earth_02: After all, those understudies in the basement simply switch cameras from one to the other by pressing the buttons, their task is to monitor whether the barrier is working. It turns out that in this context, the barrier is something that allows them to see some numbers as too emotional, although logically the barrier should only mean that the innies do not remember their extras. But why are they so similar to the MDR department? Let's say this is from the category of physiognomy, where appearance shapes character, but how to connect it? Should these understudies not make decisions, but only monitor?
@Mr_Knight: The mention of Daredevil is very useful, because his series also had a very sinful concept of "images are more important than information."
And according to sabzh: the series itself and the concept are great, but when the first season just flew in one go and there was no slack, then you expect the same movement from the second season (which, unfortunately, got into production hell).: When every frame is JUSTIFIED. But, alas and ah, you can safely watch every second episode of the second season on a fast-forward and you won't lose ANYTHING. That's what I'm talking about. That they invest a minimum of information in maximum time.
The dialogues from the previous episodes MOVED the plot, unlike the several-minute scenes of a single frame (corridor, abstract images).
That information, as in a full-fledged mini-movie (which in itself is like a taftology), could be submitted in 15 minutes and not lose anything.
@KratoFear: bro, physiognomy is a fiction for the gullible) but I give you a hundred pieces of information that this branch will not be developed) And why is that? Because the showrunners decided that this was a reserve for the next seasons, which most likely will not be, because it is very expensive. The screen
So, it seems clear that Gemma is testing how many personalities you can cram into one person before he goes cuckoo... And on the Stamp, they apparently tested the degree of isolation of personalities with her. It's just unclear what kind of cold harbor. And most importantly, why exactly Gemma and at what point did she end up there? Well, I wonder how many Marks there are in total, two or are there more? Since they don't have a clock downstairs. Another interesting point, in the title of the series, is about the picture where a man is struggling with himself and the question "how do we know that this is him?" Gemma talks about the hairstyle. Is this a hint that Mark and Mark are different people? Although I still don't believe in the theory of clones, it sounds a bit ridiculous. In my opinion, the first series with a warm color scheme. Even Mark's awakening at the end is with her.
@u1613191: And now it's clear why O&D made so many copies of different objects — because they were needed for repeated experiments with Gemma. And the MDR was 96% decrypted by Cold Harbor, and Gemma had never been in that room before. It turns out that MDR completes the project first, then Gemma can gain experience in the room.
Strongly, there is nothing else to say. It's an oppressive atmosphere, poor Gemma, locked up all this time, literally in the same room and corridors.
How unusual the separation is, at first it seemed to me that only the elevator separates, then there was a forest, and now it turns out that this technology allows you to create consciousness for several personalities and all this within different rooms. Unbelievable.
Interestingly, Innie is followed by almost copies of the main characters, and they are also absent at the same time when the heroes are not in place. The series gave some answers, showed the story of Mark and Gemma's relationship (I was waiting for this), but brought a lot of new questions.
What a cool episode! Every second is well spent. All departments are interconnected, I think. What MD is doing, I'm sure, is directly related to the Gemma tests. And her innies are being tested for their limits and reactions to what is happening. They are most likely rabbits before the product is released to the masses.
Well, if Lumon are such scum, then maybe they caused Gemma's miscarriage? Now it begins to seem to me that from the moment Mark and Gemma donated blood (or even earlier), their whole future life is a multi-step "Lumon". Maybe they found some features in their blood that are suitable for Lumon's experiments, and after that they planned everything so as to bring them to the current point?
It seems to me that when Mark finishes Cold Harbor and Gemma enters the office, her body will be completely erased, and only a body prepared for any stressful situations will remain, into which someone else's consciousness can be transferred. Well, or something else, but it's bad. So Mark doesn't have to finish the project to save her. But I'm also thinking about what Mark and Helly will do if Gemma is rescued. I feel sorry for their couple. But it looks like we're going to lose someone in the end: either Helly or Gemma.
What an incredible episode! How beautifully everything is shot and how cleverly edited, as if both Mark (during his journeying) and Gemma are experiencing the same memories, feelings. And the shot where he meets the police and finds out about her death, and Gemma tries to escape to Mark, and their faces are visible on the frame, as if looking through each other..? It's a delight 💔
Apparently, 4 tempers are being tested in different rooms: woe, dread, malice, awe? Is that why innies in MDR are looking for scary numbers? The work is mysterious and important indeed. I think there's probably something about grieving the loss of a child in the cold harbor room? Or maybe Auty Gemma will come in there? And the name of the room appeared recently, because Mark is close to completing work on the file? Is it unclear what the department is doing with the dark version of MDR? And are they all very similar in appearance to their "colleagues"? Irving 2.0 is still sitting there.. and did they change these people for others when Mark had new colleagues? Well, Dr. Mauer is definitely some kind of relative of Cyrus, a similar type, it seems to me. Just like the guy with the frolic tattoo. In general, there are a lot of questions, but the narration "answers" the questions in time, which I find incredibly enjoyable when watching and not understanding what is happening. It's a pity that the next episode will be only 37 minutes long.
Maybe these rooms are testing how different stress affects the character of inni? And then it's all somehow used in the separation to form the desired character of inni. Because Helly is definitely different from Helena, Miss Kesi is definitely different from Gemma and her other innies in character.
All these cabinets are united by one factor - the need to tolerate what is inside. Apparently, Cold Harbor is going to be the scariest place to be. Another thought - why choose Gemma? Considering that many people went to Lumon after an accident, it is possible that each victim was monitored for some time, then the accident was set up, and the company tested some of his vital signs. And based on these tests, it turned out that Gemma had the best survival results. That's the whole reason.
@re_kate: After the Lexington letters (and the story of why Bert split up), it generally feels like Lumon is deliberately inciting specific people to split up, it's too suspicious for them to come across separation ads at vulnerable moments
@re_kate: in the list of Lumon's employees, which is kept in Irving's trunk, there was one person in front of whom there was something written about a car accident and the fact that Lumon was involved in it (or in hogging it). Perhaps (ha, yes, most likely, IN the MORNING), Mark and Gemma are not the first couple on whom Lumon is experimenting.
There is also an idea that Gemma was originally a project of Lumon (one of the?), which was released into the ordinary world as part of one of the experiments (and perhaps the whole city is a kind of experience), and then pulled back to conduct further experiments
@format: And the rest are from Apple? There are only Lumon brands here, and it's not particularly clear at what time events are taking place relative to ours :D
I think this is the most beautiful episode in all two seasons. So many emotions, I will definitely review it again. Gemma is very sorry, some kind of absolute hopelessness. I don't even see how Mark can get her out of this whole situation yet. Lumon is just a corporation of psychopaths, all the way it was impossible to burn with all these doctors.
I would naively like to believe that after the completion of Cold Harbor, they plan to release Gemma. But, considering that, according to the documents, she has been dead for a long time, of course, it is unlikely. Plus the abnormal doctor
I went to the comments to write "I didn't understand a damn thing, but it's very interesting", and here are such theories... Cooler than the series itself. I understood the death of Ivan Ilyich Tolstoy by ear. I got it right only from the comments. Before this episode, Milchek was perceived as an abbreviated "nice person". And he's really really creepy. Like all the unrequited ones in Lumon.
The creators of this series have set the bar for quality as high as possible, but this series is simply the pinnacle of everything. The scenes are very beautifully staged, the professionalism of both the actors is visible (what changes Mark has made!), as well as the directors, cameramen, editors, make-up artists - in general, everyone in every frame. The visual component of this series is simply the best I've seen in a long time. At the same time, the way the plot unfolds cannot leave anyone indifferent. It's hard and scary. I really want a good ending for Gemma.. But will it be, given the last room?
@scaring_kids: JLG: “CGI? In Severance? Think Again. There's the shot that goes from MDR to the control room downstairs [via electrical cables]. There's no CGI in it. It's all real. We actually shot through cables. It was the most laborious thing I have ever done as a DP. It was the biggest side project of this show and so many people participated on it. You should see the rig for it: The camera goes through the internal part of the desk. There's a pulley moving in it.”
Pancake. So many thoughts, it's still not possible to connect it all.
1. The doctor who conducts experiments with Gemma was at the fertility clinic. Perhaps it has something to do with trying to produce the perfect man without flaws? Or there was simply a higher chance of finding a woman who wants to forget something in her life and agree to a separation.
2. Offices are subjected to stress and fears. Are they checking if the chip is working? Or are they trying to rid the extras of these fears? The picture that Dylan stole last season, according to Gemma, depicted a struggle with his demons - fears.
3. It seems that the data for processing is the workers themselves, their facial expressions, otherwise why are they constantly monitored in the monitor? But how this is related to what is happening in the rooms is not yet clear at all.
@ameliap: I completely forgot about the blood donation in the beginning - there was a Lumon badge there, so Mark and Gemma were somehow initially selected? Or does Lumon use donated blood for his experiments?
@ameliap: In the first season, it was mentioned that this Lumon was doing everything, producing medicines, all kinds of drugs and almost furniture. That is, they originally owned laboratories and medical equipment.
@Dara_G: I burst into tears already at the end credits - the last frame change from Mark waking up with wet eyes to Gemma's laughing eyes, along with sad piano music, finished me off💔
So, before this episode, I was sure that Gemma had really died, but the people from Lumon somehow managed to save a part of her consciousness, which was passed through the separation procedure, that is, that she was essentially an eternal inni, whose autie had been dead for a long time and could not be saved. Now it is clear that the main part of Gemma's personality, who she was before the accident - or rather, before the deal with Lumon - is alive, and multiplied by an unknown number of eternally suffering innies (I do not support the theory that there are only 4 personalities according to the number of temperaments - it is clear she said that she was in each of the rooms on the floor, and in each room her personality is unique: "I've just been here, it's Christmas every day," which means it's possible and necessary to save her, not only for her own sake, but also for the sake of all these unhappy women, endlessly experiencing unpleasant, traumatic moments of potential other people's lives, from which Lumon wants to save first rich clients, and then, apparently, the whole world. It is obvious that Cold Harbor means death - a special one-time innie so that autie does not have to experience the moment of passing away... Another question is, what is Lumon's idea of what should happen to Autie at this moment? Is he going to die too, or does Lumon have any plans for the surviving part of his consciousness, too? Basically, the search for immortality in one form or another is a pretty logical fixation topic for rich and ultra-rich old people, so I wouldn't be surprised. And most importantly, of course, what I'm worried about right now is whether Gemma can be saved. not in the form of Miss Casey or anyone else, but the real Gemma herself, is she even capable of living and existing outside the underground floors of Lumon, or as in the Death of Ivan Ilyich, everything will inevitably end up as it was stated from the very beginning?
Thanks to Jessica Lee Gagne for such an amazing, unique series - a phenomenal debut.
It's a very depressing, difficult episode, but visually it's top notch! It can be separately nominated in the category "Best Cinematography"👏👏👏 so many incredible shots and transitions!
When Mark was first shown in the past, I almost choked on my tea - it was so cool. The difference is not only noticeable, it is enormous! Their love story with Gemma is very beautiful and it was felt even through the screen how sincere and deep their love was, but at the same time I can't help myself and subconsciously root for Mark and Helly /Helena. At this moment, I feel divided myself, because one part is for Gemma, the other is for two versions of our red-haired beast)
Despite the beauty and uniqueness of the entire series, I still can't accept that all the chemistry between Mark and Hayley will be allowed in one place. Even though it's logical now. Brain explosion
And one more thought, inspired by YouTube: what if the cold harbor room is the same snowy forest by the lake from ORTBO? Would Gemma be drowning in a car in a lake? Xs Why and why is it so important
I'll probably write a comment. The series is simply incredible, it takes your breath away from how beautiful and dramatically difficult it is..
It seems to me that all the rooms Gemma gets into are related to their shared history with Mark.
For example, their acquaintance began with the question Who are you? The dialogue begins with the same question when you get into the Lumon.
Before leaving the house, Gemma tells Mark that she loves him, but he remains silent and she then repeats that she loves him, "oh yes, of course, I love you too," and also in one of the scenes Mark says that she does not like to write thank—you letters - then in one of the rooms she writes the letters and at the end, this "doctor" who is in all the rooms tells Gemma that he loves her and corrects her about her Make. And she says, "I love you too."
The only thing I haven't figured out yet is Wellington's room, where Gemma is at the dentist. There's nothing related to him in Gemma and Mark's story, could it be that they're putting a chip in their teeth in this room? And everyone allows you to enter a new room.
It also seems strange to me that of all the variety of Russian literature, Gemma is mostly about Tolstoy - the Death of Ivan Ilyich, Hadji Murad. It seems that I will join those who will read these works and look for a solution there.
I read Hadji Murad and it seems this work is closer to Gemma.
Hadji Murad is between two worlds: loyalty to his people and the need to cooperate with enemies in order to save his family. It seems to me that there is a direct parallel here: to be true to yourself and your principles, or to cooperate with Lumon in order to reunite with Mark and have a family
Hadji Murad is trying to free himself and the people from oppression, and Gemma is also trying to break out of the Limon.
Hadji Murad is confronted by an imperial machine where he is used in political games, and Gemma stands up to a corporation that manipulates her mind, someone else's, and controls the lives of intras and extra employees.
@achirova: if all the tests that Gemma has to go through in the rooms were created by Lumon employees in such a way as to mirror her memories, then Mark and the team are actually deciphering these memories, otherwise how else would Lumon have found out about such insignificant details. Well, or these parallels are just an artistic move. I also worry about how much everything that the characters experience is physically real, and not a simulation - for example, a room with a falling plane is difficult to explain in any other way.
@nyam0: There is a very interesting version about deciphering memories!
Can the conditions in the rooms originate from the consciousness of the extras? Like I went through X experience, it traumatized me. And I find myself in a room that is programmed to reproduce some kind of negative or sad experience.
as for what they're experiencing... I think they're physically real. Gemma has a sore mouth/ jaw, arm, which means that if she damages anything on the plane, then this injury will remain with her.
The series is quite long. I don't understand such wild raptures. No, it was well shot and there are a lot of hints. but in fact, the whole Gemma part could have been given much earlier. The first episode of season 2. And Mark literally flopped the whole episode. That's what I thought at the end of the last episode - it's probably going to fail the whole next one, and then it's going to come out. And so it turned out. It was very annoying that I had to wait for him to wake up and that after that there would be a dark screen.
In any case, it's annoying how slow the creators are to provide information. The first season was more lively and there was more life for the workers, they had a goal and they were moving towards it. Now they've almost forgotten about the workers on the line, and they don't show it in every episode anymore. But this is the most interesting thing, and that's why we fell in love with the series.
And how many years ago did Mark and Gemma go to the clinic? And-how old is Miss Huang? Could the little Asian girl be Gemma's daughter, who was cloned from blood or something?
We were shown that Cyrus is a terribly old man (and evil). Maybe he wants to move into a young body?
At the beginning of the episode, we talked about gorges. With strange hints that the gorge is about sex. "I conquered the first gorge in school" and that's it. Cold Harbor is a cold gorge. Cold sex? Cold vag *on? Something about giving birth to the dead or having sex with the dead? In any case. if she is constantly stressed in every room, then there will be final stress. And this is very important for an old billionaire.
And we were shown a little dead bride in one of the previous episodes. Cyrus was masturbating in the woods, and then there was a little dead bride? Who's the little one? Miss Huang? She plays a Russian musical instrument, Gemma is also connected with Russia. They both think that the Lumon staff are talking like crazy. Perhaps Lumon is trying to transfer consciousness into his own young clone? Are Gemma and her clone Miss Huang the test subjects?
Perhaps the task is to transfer consciousness into one's own... INNIE? In the literal sense? Into your potbelly? Do you give birth and during the wild stress your consciousness is transferred to the one you are giving birth to?? Extra-innie, outside-inside like a mother-child?
@Roland23: I liked one theory in the American community that Miss Huang is actually not related to Gemma in any way, but she is specifically Asian so that everyone speculates on this topic and gets distracted from the main thing)) I don't know, we'll see over time, Huang hasn't been revealed at all yet, although the mysteries surrounding her are some of the most interesting of the season. I mean, if she ends up being just a schoolgirl who moonlights as a motion controller, I'd be as surprised as if she turned out to be Gemma's clone. In general, we still don't know much about the chip and its capabilities, this series has clearly made it clear that they are much broader than expected. What if Miss Huang is actually an adult Gemma, but the chip affects the brain and makes everyone around her see her as a little girl? Well, this is schizotheory)))
@dariaul: I support the theory that they are not related in any way. It seems to me that this is just a soft-racism Lumon, where an employee of Asian descent is replaced by the same Asian, and also a jab towards the viewer that if it were just some European girl, and Gemma is a white madam, then we would be less confident building such theories about kinship.
@Roland23: I've had the idea since the first episode that Miss Huang is Gemma's relative, but it doesn't seem to have been more than 3 years since Gemma's death, at most 5
@Roland23: And this is where they showed us the old evil Cyrus? If it wasn't Cyrus who was talking to Helena. And it wasn't Cyrus who was jerking off in the woods.
@Roland23: No, he's a descendant of the founder, at least based on what I've told you so far. In the center of eternity, there was a bunch of Igons that were after Cyrus.
And the name of the series.. Chihai bardo is the state between death and rebirth. Does this mean that Mark has been reintegrated?
They write that this is a transformation and a search for truth. Transformation is more about Mark, of course. But Gemma is looking for the truth, trying to escape and free herself.
I don't even want to think about what's real anymore. in principle, everything can come down to fictional / staged memories and none of the characters are extra
In general, the series answered almost all the questions. The macro data processing department is engaged in defragmentation of consciousness. The chip in their brains digitizes their memories, which they sort further, or rather their intro. That is why they unconsciously understand where the numbers are scary and where they are not. Globally, this is an experiment aimed at understanding how much it is possible to rewrite consciousness and get a new personality. The one you choose. Without fears, without complexes, without injuries, etc. More confident, the one who can write with her left hand and generally do anything. I learned it intro, but I use it extra. Lumon achieves stable results. In general, everything is even simpler. There were no intros from the beginning. The intro is a chip. And the extra simply rents out his body and brain to plant a new personality, which is contained in the chip. In short, I think the theory about the immortal Aegons is correct. They want to learn how to transplant their consciousness. It turns out that Mark's wife was abducted at the moment when, most likely for the sake of IVF, she fit into a pilot experimental separation test program for pain relief during childbirth. But then a crazy doctor got caught and something went wrong...
@Dimka_Elik: I don't think that the chip initially contains another personality, most likely, it provokes the so-called death of the ego and maintains this state, which allows you to build self-awareness and personality anew. But if Inni is not isolated, but allowed to communicate and live in the same conditions as Extra, it seems to me that over time, he will become absolutely the same person.
@KudasaiYo: Yes, our heroes originally had chips like dummies, empty. And by defragmenting, they recreate their personalities and write them onto the chip. Further, in theory, the chip can be extracted and the finished consciousness can be transplanted into any other carrier. This is confirmed by animal tests. It will be funny if that's the case, because this is essentially the plot of the Cyberpunk 2077 game)
@Dimka_Elik: it's a curious hypothesis, but remembering all the same legsinctong letters, it can be argued that intras consist of some basic part of the extra (how would the intra know the fictional extra language). That is, at the time of their appearance (conditionally), this is 20% of the extras (they do not remember the remaining 80%), and then living at work, they are already independently developing, gaining their intro experience. Extra Irving can draw, and so can his intra, although Extra had the experience of learning
@Dimka_Elik: If each employee is working with their own memories, then it's unclear why the rooms Gemma walks through are named after the projects Mark is working on. If the same thing happens to all the employees there, it's unclear why they couldn't finish without Mark.
@ameliap: He and Gemma have shared memories, we were shown events in which they and Mark are always together. Anyway, this is just my guess. I don't know why the department couldn't finish without Mark... Although why couldn't he, what couldn't he? Everyone is working on their own file. If, for example, Irving's files were named the same as Gemma's rooms, then there would be a question.
@Dimka_Elik: Gemma doesn't just go to Mark's rooms. We were shown the doors of Tumwater (this project was completed by Dylan in the first season) and Siena (this was Helly's first). Since Gemma mentions that she only knows the name Cold Harbor, we can conclude that she has already been in the two rooms mentioned above.
@Dimka_Elik: An unjustified theory. It took Mark's chip to be flooded (read: destroyed) in order for his personalities to collapse, respectively, if the chip was destroyed, his intro personality would also be destroyed, the chip separates it, and I adhere to the version that it separates from bad memories, for example#34;frightening" (first folder on the left), or annoying, or causing grief, sadness, rage, boredom, anger, etc. But if the goal is so good, why is this project so secret? After all, none of the outsiders knows what exactly they are doing.
@lamur: for some reason, it seems to me that Mark's personality will not become one. It's just that intra will have access to extra's memories and vice versa, extra will have access to intra's memory. They will understand each other's feelings and motives. But they will remain different Brands.
@Dimka_Elik: so it still turns out that they will transplant not the consciousness itself, but its digital copy, the original will eventually wash away anyway and will not know what happened after the transfer of consciousness...
I think this Dr. Mauer was at the beginning of the fifth episode, where they didn't show us his face, but he approached the staff from the optics and design department for tools. He met Gemma with the same instruments at the dentist's office in Wellington.
@achirova: @achirova: yes, it became obvious as soon as the dentist's chair was shown, I think right now that guy with the cart is coming :D in any case, it's unclear why they didn't show us his face then, it seems like he hadn't met before, it wouldn't have given any information.
@Earth_02: as for why it wasn't shown immediately, the question is, but why it was shown, in principle, I think to chronologically mark it.. but it's unclear why to do this at the beginning of the episode, where there are no hints at Miss Casey or Gemma at all.
@Earth_02: it seems to me that this is such a peculiar focus on the tools made in that series. Like, it doesn't matter who, it's the tools that matter. And the face has now been opened
The series leaves an indelible impression, and I agree with most of the comments. Just one question, why doesn't anyone talk about this terribly strange shot of Mark changing clothes in the Lumen hallway?)) The range of clothes is very interesting - if you don't look closely, he seems to be wearing American medical clothes, and then he pulls on a sweater before entering Gemma's bathroom from the Lumen corridor, as if hiding. Of course, this may not mean anything, but I don't believe that such a selection of clothes and frames was wasted)) Ben Stiller and Dan Erickson proved a long time ago that they have every shot like that. By the way, Jessica Lee Gagne is an absolute magician, if the series in season 25 does not receive all the awards just for her work, I will be very angry))) Well, at least she should get an Emmy for cinematography.
@dariaul: @dariaul: as I understand it, they were examined at the clinic, and they took tests from him and he changed clothes after them? But I don't remember the frame very well, I need to review it.
@id_evergreen: No, he's actually wearing a polo shirt and jeans there - both things are the same sky-blue color, if you don't look closely, they look like uniforms.
After the episode, I felt the same way Gemma did at the end...
It's a very interesting series, very intense, but so heavy. And again, how do the actors act out🤌 With just one glance, they can convey the whole essence of a scene.
Gorgeous visual, and awesome meaning... And now it is not clear whether Gemma is still alive, and whether the doctor who was in the hospital before was involved in her disappearance.... AAAAAAA!!!! I hope everything else will be explained sometime)
By God, the mystic is already sick of these mysteries. It's time to unravel this tangle. No matter how it was with the Lost Finale series, it's about nothing.
@ValeriiaBielaia: "Lost" messed up a lot of places. I didn't know when to stop in time, as some of the answers didn't seem to have been thought out in advance and were written on my knee (what can I say if some of the answers were given in special episodes). So far, the separation doesn't make such an impression, it feels like everything is going exactly according to an already thought-out scenario, and everything has a clear explanation, and not just an unusual joke to surprise the viewer, but what it means, we'll figure it out later- just read The comments are here or on Reddit, people have almost covered everything.
It's a bit early to close the series - it has excellent ratings, and this is only the second season (Lost has 6 of them, and the slide did not happen on the second, but later). Let them take off at least three or four.
What a hopelessness. What Gemma is going through is just terrible. One of her personalities sits endlessly at the dentist's office, the other endlessly signs silly postcards.... It turns out that she has been subjected to experiments for two years. And only the number of rooms is growing. And what will happen when she passes Cold Harbor, why will she have to say goodbye?
And the most heartbreaking thing is that the outer Gemma remembers everything. Just let Mark save her and they'll be happy. 💔
@tipaigrok: I mean, he remembers his real life and the Brand he wants to return to. For some reason, it seemed to me that even if Mark found her, she wouldn't remember him or anything from her past life.
It turns out that MDR employees are a kind of innies observers, they record deviations in their emotions (the same strange floating numbers on computers among the normal ones) and sort them into the right categories (perhaps depending on the emotion — fear, aggression, sadness). Thus, they are training a model that, when it reaches 100% (Cold Harbor), will create a system in which the brain will switch to the innie mode itself in case of a stressful situation. It's a kind of Lumon product, a perfect separation. No elevators are needed (now it has also become clearer that the elevator context is important only for our main characters, but within the entire corporation, the transition from the innie /outie mode can occur even just at the entrance to some office - obviously, over time, even the doors will not be needed).
I have an absolutely crazy theory. Help to debunk it or, conversely, to finish it. :D
It haunts me that Irving knows about the existence of the black elevator for some reason. Previously, we assumed that he was the elevator that took the innies to the test site, where they were rebooted, but in this episode, the idea of the lower floor has changed.
Irving has been working for Lumon for 9 years, and only 3 in the processing department. Where could he have worked before? He is interested in art - could this be an indication of the optics and design department? :) We know from Felicia's words that their employee used to go to the export corridor. Something has happened that the rules have changed. I would venture to assume that three years ago Irving witnessed what was happening there. That he told his colleagues about it, and the uprising of the optics and design department is not just a rumor. This would also explain their attitude against the handlers: they learned that the handlers - literally - create conditions for torture. The information on Irving's chip will be erased after that. As an inni employee, he will be transferred to the processing department, but auty (this is where my version is bursting at the seams) must find out about the black elevator from somewhere. Auty goes to the office every day only to leave his zeroed inni inside the corporation as a mole, which Inni himself does not suspect for three years, until Irving comes up with not sleeping. I also suggest that perhaps Irving's appearance served as an impetus for Petey's reintegration. Something must have happened before he made that decision, right? "What if we kill people there for 8 hours a day?They actually kill people for 8 hours a day, and Peter knows this when he turns to Mark, but this knowledge could not have been obtained by him only because of the reintegration process, because his innie has no information about the black elevator.
@Gribnika: A Lumon profile was created on LinkedIn during the first season, and there is an entry saying that here, take an example from our employee Irving B., who has been faithful to the principles of the corporation for nine years))
@Shtusha-Kutusha: excellent theory) so far, in my opinion, there is not enough data to debunk.
The fact that Irving was attracted to Bert may indicate a previous acquaintance (or Bert was digging under him to understand that Inni Irving knows). And Bert is from optics, which is also relevant for any of the options (they crossed paths there earlier, or Bert appears as an employee of this department to check at the same time if Irving remembers anything when contacting the department).
@Shtusha-Kutusha: and if Irving worked in Lumon before OMD without being separated, then he could see the elevator and there is no need to think about erasing memory. Maybe he was an intern like Miss Huang, for example, he found out something unnecessary about the elevator (did he go down once?) and he was allowed to stay only if he split up after that.
@Gribnika: it's kind of strange, with all the security measures, to let out a person who knows so much inside and at the same time does not belong to a close circle of high-ranking
@Gribnika: I agree with @ameliap: it would not only be inconsiderate, but also dangerous, especially for the corporation itself. If only... Unless Auty Irving knows about the elevator because he switched in it after going down to the lower floor. I saw something I shouldn't have seen, and I got up right away. So Lumon has a reason to restrict access to the elevator for ordinary employees, and Irving knows about the experiments from the outside, but the management, by a happy coincidence, does not know about his awareness. But all this is just speculation))))))
@Shtusha-Kutusha: but auty draws a view of the elevator from a divided floor, not from a test one, in the paintings the downward arrow at the elevator and the corridor are dark. And there was no way Auti could have seen the elevator on a split floor if he was split when he saw it. Unless maybe he flipped the arrow in the painting specifically for Inny, so that he would know that it was about an elevator going down.
@Shtusha-Kutusha: Felicia (a woman from processing, I don't remember the exact name) remembers the times when they went down themselves, and remembers how to get there. I think she would have remembered Irving, too, if he had worked there before they were forbidden to go downstairs themselves.
@id_evergreen: She doesn't say that they went down, she says that they were delivered to the transportation corridor. Perhaps they were just loaded into the elevator or left near it. And then someone came down and they were forbidden. But it's definitely not clear how it happened.
@Gribnika: I've already listened to it - she says "used to go ourselves, but now they send a guy." And where did she mean by go xs, but you're probably right, since we're talking about exports hall, then go is probably talking about the hall.
@Gribnika: listening again, she remembered that she had worked with Bert for six years, that is, if Irv had worked there, then even earlier, in his first three years at Lumon
@Shtusha-Kutusha: not bad! And how he could have found out about the black elevator can be assumed. The separation procedure may well not have been so perfect yet. It seems that one of the tasks of working with Gemma now is to understand if she still has something from the rooms she has visited, besides physical sensations. And then, a few years ago, a particularly traumatic memory could slip through an unfinished system.
I've been waiting for this particular episode for months to try to spot my best friend in it, who was supposed to pass Gemma in the very first scene, but alas, this frame/angle didn't make it into the series... It 's a shame.
In any case, the series turned out to be very interesting and informative) Finally, at least some things about Gemma became clear.
So you have to try to make the viewer fall in love with the character in one episode. Yes, not even for the episode, but for the first minute of ahaha Gemma's pair with Mark looks so perfect. An amazing series, every second and every frame. This is the level that I want to see in all series. How to give it infinity instead of 5 stars..
1) I think that every type of clothing is an immediate signal of what kind of pain awaits her. ie , a red dress is a pain in the mouth The blue airplane Dress The red robe is Christmas. That's why when she saw the red dress, she said "damn" because she realized what was waiting for her today.
Thus causing not only physical discomfort, but also an associative series.
There is a feeling that she voluntarily agreed to this experiment, because she urgently said "I want to go home" as if SHE could decide when it was time for her to leave, or at least she was given such hope that when she said she would be released. And what if they stress her inni in order to check whether the consciousness will switch to the Present in extreme conditions that can occur in ordinary life, after which they will replace the extended consciousness with any other and will be sure that under no circumstances will there be a malfunction ... but then why Gemma and if the separation works successfully What 's the problem with women in labor ?
@ValeriyaKuzmenko: possibly voluntarily or forcibly. For example, Lumon could have caused the accident, and then brought her to his place and said that, for example, they had saved her, but she had been in a coma for so long. And offer to stay, to become a new person, to get rid of the inner pain. They also tell her about Mark that he has forgotten her, and is leading his own life (perhaps this is not the first time she has asked about Mark, which is why the doctor answered her so sharply that he has a family and a child) . So she decides to stay on her own. By the way, I wonder how many offices there are. She doesn't have enough teeth to pick at them every day. And the next day, she won't be able to write with her left hand because of the pain for at least a week. And even if she wrote often, she would already write easily with her left hand. Therefore, it seems to me that, first of all, not all cabinets are connected specifically with her experiences. And there are a lot of offices there, if 4 people per quarter were closed according to the project, then it turns out in 2 years about 32. How many innies does she have then? And maybe she's not the only one there. Because the wall of smiles in season 1 shows how many people Lumon has already made happy.
Mark has finished 24 files, we can see that on the screen of the person who is following Mark, Cold Harbor will be the 25th. If all of the OMDS work at about the same pace, then about 100 files/rooms/inni are obtained.
First of all, they definitely had some kind of problem with recognizing acquaintances: employees have to leave at different times so that extras don't meet, plus Milchek is happy for the first time that chip is working when Mark and Gemma don't recognize each other in the break room, even though they've been separated for 12 years.
Secondly, they are probably working to ensure that one person has a lot of innies. But it's not clear why. I would assume that they are making a secret agent for the special services who cannot be cracked - for each legend there is a separate inni under cover who knows nothing about the real person. But this does not fit in with the fact that Cold Harbor will be a breakthrough for all mankind.
If Gemma is alive, then who did Mark identify after the accident, it seems that he himself said in a conversation with his sister that there was an identification
@sunlost: why is this a question at all :D judging by other TV series and (probably) cases in real life, to find a corpse similar in shape, set it on fire and then show it to a grieving husband (who is clearly in a state of shock will sign any papers and will not look at and compare the impression of teeth, yes....), not so much And it's unrealistic, especially for a big evil corporation.
Gemma's heartbreaking story....She's a real test subject! It's so scary!!! and it turns out, if I understood correctly, she has several divisions, since she switches between going into different rooms and exiting the elevator? the elevator moment is generally a nightmare...is there really no one who would sympathize and help her?
@FringeMania: I foresee even more difficulties in the fact that Mark will most likely go down to her floor with Helly. And Helly will turn into Helena in the elevator, who, of course, will immediately find out where they are and for what purpose.
@Shtusha-Kutusha: Yeah, it turns into a kind of puzzle when you have to go through several gates in a certain order in order to eventually get the right innings or outs!
@Shtusha-Kutusha: If Mark reintegrates successfully, he should understand that without turning on the special mode outside the divided floor, Helly will immediately become Helena
@id_evergreen: It also shows specifically, and everyone knows about it, that there is a floor divided, and not the entire building, i.e. why on earth would he think that the division extends to the basement if it is not on other floors.
The Macro Data department sorts the numbers that have an emotional connotation, each such project has a name.
Gemma - gets access to the room after the project is completed, i.e. does the macro data department create the separation itself? A new identity?
The macro data processing department completes the project, a new room opens, which Gemma begins to visit, where her new inner self begins to endlessly experience a negative emotion or fear of the original, i.e. extra, as I understood from the comments, these are Gemma's personal fears (dentistry, fear of flying, hatred of Christmas cards).
I have a couple of assumptions, for example, that the Cold Harbor project will be associated with endless death, possibly Gemma's drowning. Because the literal translation of Cold Harbor hints at both drowning in water and death (the name of one of the battles of the American Civil War)
But what, how, for what and why, there are interesting theories in the comments, but I think these are just guesses, in the sense that no one guessed and the creators will present another surprise, perhaps even a plot twist that everyone will be shocked by.
For example, what if Lumen is good? Eh? Well, everyone will be shocked, everyone thinks that Lumen is pure evil.
Just an amazing episode! So far, the best of the season, both meaningfully and visually incredibly beautiful! I just looked at it in one breath, whereas the previous ones were a bit difficult. Still, it's a little hard to watch a series like this once a week. But this series is a masterpiece. The footage of Mark and Gemma's happy life is just the perfect movie. And what a hell she's living in now! She's got a lot more personalities, it's just tough. God, save her now.
For some reason, I don't know if this is partly true or not, it seems that Jema came to lumon on her own, since everything was going downhill with Mark, and she probably wanted to forget him because it was hard to do it herself and disappear (echoes of the Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind), but everything went not according to plan, and she became a very suitable experimental object for Lumon, and got stuck there. It felt good when she freaked out and said I want to go home, and in response they told her that Mark got married and had a daughter, she immediately had a sharp rejection, and Lumon realized that the system was not working with her. And when she came back downstairs at the very end, separated, she started crying anyway and said Mark... she almost burst into tears herself. The series is amazing
It seemed to me that at the end, when the elevator ominously opened, the nurse looked very much like the murdered head of the security service who was at Harmony's. As if his sister were his own)
@Miss_28: their New Year's toys are the same in shape in the memories and in the torture room, although they may all be stamped at the same lumen factory.
The creators of the series have a high level of attention to detail: in the scene in Gemma's office, when Mark gives her an ant farm, there is a portrait of Alexander Blok on the wall. It is visible for literally a millisecond, and only Russian-speaking viewers who stare at such a portrait in the classrooms of Russian and literature will recognize it. The greatest class!
Since they showed us that they had created a room in lumen that simulates flight and turbulence, did they know that the series in the forest was taking place somewhere on the same floor, no?
I've been thinking all this time that Mark/the actor really has such a creepy appearance. I don't know how to explain it, but he's just like a terrifying wax doll. And suddenly Mark is shown on the day he meets his wife and he is a normal, handsome young man. Awesome. Why he was made such a freak in the present is not very clear to me.…
@darika_007: Perhaps this can be explained by prolonged depression. By what he drinks. Petey mentioned in the first season that even in the office, his grief is with him, he just doesn't know the reasons - but he still feels deep sadness.
I'm really sorry for Gemma, they're doing some terrible experiments on her. Question: how did she get into Lumen, by herself or by trickery? Mark didn't know anything about it. And it's sad, of course, if it all started because of the desire to have a child.
I liked the first season. But the paradox is, did I expect the second one? No. I already understood from the first one how they would pull the rubber here. Even Episode 7 with Gemma didn't change anything. Of course I'll watch the rest of the season. But will I look further? No. I just don't like these guessing games. So that you don't fantasize or notice, the creators are still a hundred steps ahead.
Some might say that this is an unusual puzzle series. As far as I'm concerned, this is a complete nut job. A matter of perception. I'm just not interested in following these characters. The end of the first season gave hope that something interesting would begin in the second, but everything returned to stuffy puzzles again, with some kind of dullness.
My grandfather fell in love with my grandfather, and every time he appears, interrupting at least some interesting plot, he is terribly infuriating. I rarely experience this...
The corporation has become a banal sect. The characters, the same Milchik, are caricatured and cause nothing but laughter at all. The actor is good, but I do not know what the director was trying to show with this image of the hero.
The whole series is kind of surreal, covered with puzzles, pretentious speeches, incredibly tedious, every frame of which is stretched to the limit... and with a lot of positive feedback. It's absurd...
I endured 7 episodes of the second season hoping for a miracle, but eventually dropped this series. It's impossible to watch it. It's killing time.
at the same time, I really like the series, but I also have the feeling that it's absurd for the sake of absurdity. I would like this season to be the last.
Independent thoughts: 1) Can Gemma be innie too? And he released her "into the wild" Lumen to see, for example, if she could socialize? Then they staged an accident to return it? 2) In the scene when Gemma leaves the house on the evening of "death", perhaps she herself went to lumen to "forget" the death of the child, Mark will then follow the same path to forget Gemma's death…
@tamtamchik: what an interesting idea) I also thought about Bert, is it possible for him and his boyfriend to be in Luman for 20 years, it's just that his boyfriend is already old and talking too much, but this one is still holding on to his role, because he could be the same employee who is specifically friends with others in order to check them for something) I personally found it very suspicious It's all about getting to know each other, friendship, and conversation.
I've loved Adam Scott since the days of Parks (well, he's cool in BML too), and it was so nice to see him with his usual hairstyle! How hair changes the image :)
It seemed to me that Gemma was taken to the dentist to have her teeth replaced with implants. And use them to identify the corpse that was prepared to fake her death.
Discussion: Season 2, Episode 7 Join the Discussion
398I remember Irving with his "let's burn this place down." I hope they will be able to do this soon.
And in the psychology room, he repeatedly tried to hint that maybe you, Gemma, are also living a happy life somewhere in one of the rooms (with me, the doctor). And about Mark and the kids, why did he lie? And they also told him at the council that after the end of the project he would have to let her go, but he reluctantly nodded. (And he wore a reindeer sweater because it was a sweater from their love room.)
Carriage of signs )) Although this does not negate the fact that he is still a sadist, and this love is very cruel and abnormal.
It seems that they called him and called him back to the office - they just showed us what for.
The most interesting thing is what kind of personality will turn out after reintegration. And how is Mark going to deal with such a dilemma? Is throwing a Helly working out?
Or even wrong.. Helly is a 2b1b2 Brand, and Gemma is a 1-in-Many-in-1 brand. 🤔
In other words, a person with such an attribute is prone to pathological rejection of anything that is not coplanar: people with a different opinion about art are labeled as having bad taste.;
people with radically different interests enroll in geeks/autists or vice versa in a social network and so on. and so on.
Hence the obscene "how did you like what I didn't like? Did you all get a SHOT in the BRAIN here?". From the same opera, by the way, the classic what did the author smoke?"#34; whom, I think, many have met.
In truth, it's even a bit of a pity that the users above spent the time trying to consciously communicate with such an individual.
The vast majority of users express first-order opinions in their comments. The user to whom I replied expresses a second-order opinion about those who broadcast a first-order opinion that is not similar to his own, and expresses it in an extremely offensive way, hinting at problems with cognitive functions, legal capacity, etc. Thus, my discussion with him lies on a different plane (2 order - 2 order) than his discussion (2 order - 1 order).
This is how I see this situation, and it doesn't follow from this description that I did anything similar to what the user I was responding to did. You can say that I insulted him too, but this statement is from a position of toothlessness and cowardice, since the actor of aggression always deserves a symmetrical reaction.
Snobbery? Maybe. I won't even deny it. This reminds me of a case about 10 years ago, in the comments on VKontakte, a lady began to aggressively assert the same thing to me (that I was a snob) because of... my use of the word cluster in the text is without comment. Maybe you were offended by the fact that someone has the ability to operate with vocabulary more extensive than yours and make up narratives without difficulty? Well, that's up to you. You can call me a snob and something else about stupidity, if that makes you feel better.
Your long-winded explanation of "multiple opinions" and "narratives" is impressive, but unfortunately it doesn't make your position any less vulnerable. You're trying to justify your aggression by using complicated terms and second-order opinions. However, if you put aside all this verbal fog, the essence of your message boils down to a simple one: "I'm smarter than you, and you're shit." You talk about a symmetrical reaction, but at the same time you start with insults, hinting at the cognitive problems of others. This is not an argument — it's just an attempt to elevate yourself by humiliating others. Your comparison with the Vkontakte cluster only confirms that you like to play at intellectual superiority, even when it's inappropriate.
By the way, snobbery is not about intelligence, but about the desire to appear superior to others. And your message is a prime example of this: instead of arguing on the merits, you hide behind complex constructions to hide the lack of real arguments. If it's so important to feel superior, please continue. Although, maybe instead of hiding behind complex constructions, you will try to explain why your opinion should be more important than someone else's? Or is this a third-order opinion that you forgot to mention?
See, I can do that too. It doesn't change the essence. Aggression breeds aggression, and so on ad infinitum.
I'm smarter than you, and you're shit.
So this is how you see this situation through the prism of your own thinking.
You know what the joke is: You literally can't pass by when someone, in your opinion, is trying to appear taller than someone, and you're already trying to appear taller than them.
You are the person you are describing in this situation.
My example about VKontakte, by the way, shows a variant of how a person with a wounded self-esteem is ready to see a manifestation of a snob, an upstart, and further down the list in any nonsense, and start trying to poke his nose into it so that he would be ashamed of such audacity.
And aggression, which, according to you, breeds aggression indefinitely, is not only direct insults or physical violence - our dialogue is also aggressive in its own way. Hence your desire to prove to me that I am worse than the user who insults everyone under this episode, coupled with the desire to stop aggression, it becomes schizophrenic.
And I didn't call you schizophrenic, I called the intention you have in our dialogue schizophrenic, absurd, contradicting yourself in the moment.
You come in and, without any arguments, you insult me with that user in my manner of speaking, and you also call me a snob without arguments. When I explain in detail, chewing it out as if for a child, why this is not the case in my opinion, you call my arguments demagoguery and start clowning, allegedly parodying me.
Now you're saying that you can't draw conclusions based on small introductory statements, but at the same time you can safely draw conclusions about who I am from 1-2-3 messages))) Are you saying that your position is consistent and consistent? It's already really funny to me.
It turns out to be a kind of local fork of Hottentot ethics
: You insult, and I denounce
. You are a demagogue, and I am a born speaker. You are a p***
**s, and I am D'Artagnan.;
For this corporation, in fact, the life of one person or a group of people is worthless, because they pursue higher goals.… Probably, the heroes just turned up handy.
Irving was probably there because of his father.
Well, with Mark and Gemma, they decided to conduct the most antisocial experiment possible (perhaps the doctor initially had a crush and advised the leadership to initiate the murder).
Devon and Regaby talk as if they've known each other for a long time. Gemma suddenly speaks Russian. All these rooms. Brains are boiling..
The plot is still unclear, but it was beautiful and sad at the same time.
Gemma voiced my question to all the leaders of Lumon.
Lumon is working on the possibility of dividing human consciousness by any means... Trouble? One of Gemma's personalities stays at the dentist forever, the other sits in the cabin of the plane forever...
Obviously, she was selected for this experiment at the infertility clinic.
Why does she sign postcards with her left hand, but fill out the questionnaire with her right?
In the rooms, Inni is subjected to tremendous stress, the macrodata department erases negative memories, and reintegration is needed to combine all the accumulated experience in one person and the result is an incredibly strong psyche that can survive the introduction of another person's consciousness - in short, Lumon is trying to resurrect the dead in the bodies of living people or find a way for the Igans to live forever.
But, goats don't fit in😆
Tolstoy's story "The Death of Ivan Ilyich" is mentioned twice, and he is also about Chikhai Bardo. That death ceases to exist the moment a person ceases to be afraid of death. All the innies of Gemma are struggling with their fears, with their egos. She doesn't remember how she overcomes the trials, but nevertheless she becomes... well, conditionally stronger and better. It improves it.
The Macro Science department is most likely CREATING these tests. Gemma visits the classrooms with the names of already completed projects. Cold Harbor will be for her- what? The final deadly obstacle? There she will have to overcome the fear of death.
Lumon is on the verge of inventing eternal life, and in their concept, a person needs to kill his ego for this. To tame temperaments.
That's what goats are in the mammalian department, it seems to me...
And I also wonder what the modes do besides overtime.
That is, it can be assumed that people with a chip in their brain in this house will switch to innies.
Here I think it's still 3d + remote. Then he explains how Inni only woke up in the forest, and Jamma was on the plane. And "remotely " then they can simply turn on small 3d at the right coordinates.
So you can't go outside, only down and the switch will work in the opposite direction. At the same time, the inns from the divided floor will become their own external ones.
This episode reminded me of Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind, only if it was a horror movie.
It's creepy.
Like anesthesia, only for those cases when you need to be conscious. Well, most of those who split up from you won't even think about it — you weren't one of them.
The first time they're shown to us, there are four of them, each like a double of our heroes (more doppelgangers). But the second time, no one is sitting at one of the computers. This happens during Mark's nosebleed, meaning the surveillance officer dropped out with Irving.
I also noticed that Mark mentions from his memoirs that Gemma hates writing thank-you letters. :(
The series is simply incredible in every way, but first of all, it is incredibly beautifully shot.
a couple of interesting points:
1. Mark is innocent of Gemma's death, which is a good thing.
2. unexpectedly, it is divided into so many parts that are not related to each other in any way.
3. The dude who confesses his love to her probably really loves her.
4. The series is visually just sweet, all these creative transitions, colors, stylization of flashbacks for film (or shooting on film itself), all this caused me a puppy delight.
5. Devon?? Is everything OK?? About yourself at all?? Who should I call??
And Devon was freaking out, yes. We seemed to be communicating normally, and then she was like, "I'm going to call an angry woman," and she was kind of shocked after that that the doctor was leaving her, running away in fear.
I already exhaled that Mark was sitting at home that ill-fated night, otherwise the theories had already gone to the theories of the fans of "Separation"…
Again, it's not clear how to wait a week, there are more and more thoughts and questions, we need to review the series again.
And the caste in the Division is really brilliant. I was so touched by the actress playing the role of Gemma, just to the point of tears... The series made me reflect, and that's what I'm going to do.
1) Mark and Gemma wanted a baby; miscarriage, talks about adoption, tests in clinics, frustration 2) Gemma gets something from the Lumon Clinic in the mail (isn't that their card she's looking at?) 3) Gemma goes out somewhere in the evening, she is abducted (?) Lumon and make it look like an accident? 4) then they keep her locked up from the rest of the world, separate her, and experiment on her in different rooms. At the same time, they lie about Mark and what's going on. 5) It's creepy, but she's been separated so many times that she doesn't remember what's going on in different rooms... What if there is a multi-level division, like an inni within an inni? 6) It's still unclear why they're doing all this to Gemma. What is Lumon trying to create?
We were shown all these rooms - Allentown, Cairns, Dranesville, Siena, Loveland, Tumwater, Adelaiade, Sopchoppy, Rhodes, Cold Harbor. They're the names of the projects in the folders. These are all names of some cities or places, which in itself does not mean anything.
Wellington (and number 23) is a dentist, as we were shown.
what is Denali (Gemma asks Mark about it before she leaves that evening)?
Interestingly, they said about Kobell - she was raised by them, so is there still some kind of employee education program?
And finally, a wild idea arose - what do the projects themselves mean nothing? It's just that Gemma is taken through different superstress situations to test the cognitive load of her various inns to determine the reliability of the separation procedure. And the macro data processing department processes the results of these very tests.
P.S. I really like the film filter that highlights flashbacks. It's nice to look at such a picture. A clip from a happy movie about the beginning of their relationship is generally a delight to the eyes. You don't often see such beauty even on the big screen.
yo dawg, we put an innie inside your innie so you could innie while you innie
And it turns out Gemma is on the lower floor of the outty, each room has a separate inny, on the divided Ms Casey, I wonder if when she goes upstairs she will be Gemma or there will also be a twist. That is, if Helly had got to the lower floor, Helena would have been there and it wouldn't have helped Mark, or if he had gotten to the reintegration himself, he wouldn't have really figured it out either. And now, having been reintegrated, there are chances to save her by being at the bottom, or at least not to bring her to 100% Cold Harbor.
In general, I hope Mark will somehow stop this process, it was clear that Lumon had completely gone, but after this series he was shocked by these people. The doctor who told Gemma that Mark got married and had a daughter - it's not enough to knock him with a chair, plus these employees who monitor the project... I really hope there won't be a 100% completion rate. Oh, in general, the series is amazing, despite everything that happens in it, I wonder what will happen next, and what the reintegrated Mark will do.
P.S. I'll also mention Devon in the series - before that I thought she was the most rational character, but then I was surprised. Should I call a dog?? Seriously?
It's clear that the whole division revolves around the metaphor of death (Innie Irving), but there was a bold hint in this episode, too, when Milkshake sent the reborn Miss Casey back into the elevator without answering a single question. Rough.
It's a pity that Milchik is still a Lumen six, I hoped to the last that he was normal. Seriously, Devon? Should I call a dog?
And I would also like to admire the beauty of the series, the moments of joy in the life of Mark and Gemma were reminiscent of the movie "Man and Woman", so much tenderness in every frame.
I didn't see Mark's depression before Gemma disappeared - just a man immersed in his work with his head, and of course he is also upset because of his wife's failures / sadness. But when she "died" - he started drinking, sleeping poorly, wandering aimlessly around the house, leading a closed lifestyle - these are signs of real depression.
Locked with two floors
He's already out of breath, how could he not freak out (even though he's already on the verge)
I'm absolutely thrilled with how stunningly shot this episode is, and how incredibly light and color are used in this series. Sunlight as a metaphor for love is great. The scenes from before, shot on warm grainy film, in the same retro style as the divided office, but with the exact opposite atmosphere, are brilliant. Cold colors and darkness as a metaphor for coldness and despair are mind—blowing. For the first time, spring/summer was shown only in the world where Gemma was, and which, as in the myth of Persephone, seemed to turn into eternal winter when she went to the underworld of Lumon — wonderful, amazing, wonderful
In the story, the doctor worked at the reproductive clinic that Gemma visited. I didn't get the impression that she was abducted, so I think she really died in a car accident and her body was stolen from the morgue (maybe there was some fine print in the contract of this clinic that allows them to do this, and she technically agreed to it that's all).
Does it seem like Inni Gemma is turned on anew in every new room? Are they testing the limit of personalities that can be crammed into one person? There was a theory that Gemma's real identity was being restored with the help of Cold Harbor, which turns out to be untrue since she remembers Mark, but now it's even more unclear what he was doing then. Is he creating a situation so traumatic that she can remember it even outside of separation?
I love that Gemma also ends up trying to escape (it's absolutely heartbreaking how her Boyfriend turns her back on), and how we were told that the first time she tried to bite off the doctor's fingers was yet another feral girl representation from severance. To be honest, the actress seems to have a lot of botox, because her facial expressions are very plastic, and the emotional moments are quite flat from this. But on the whole, I'm very glad that they finally paid attention to her, too, and we saw what she really was like.
MY DISMISSAL...
Is he creating a situation so traumatic that she will be able to remember it even beyond separation?
According to numerous references, there is either a situation of death through inni, or something as close as possible to this without real death, or the death of inni's ego in order to use this body for something else. As in the elevator scene, Milchik is basically like this: "Don't ask unnecessary questions, go back to oblivion."
Somehow, everything turned gloomy. To think that a few episodes ago, people here were discussing Mark's navel height))
And after this episode, it's already clear that the accident is a staged Lumens.
If these rooms are an experience that people would like to get rid of by dividing themselves, as in the case of a woman who divided herself for the birth of a child, then cold Harbor is like the last room...Is it an experience of death? That's why she's the last one, that's why they promise to release her (they don't promise that she's alive), and in general, she's already dead in the outside world.
They say the record for holding your breath is 24 minutes 37 seconds. How do you explain the fact that I haven't breathed in all these 50 minutes? Mmm?
I also liked the moment where she walks through a metaphorical tunnel with a light at the end. But Milchik doesn't let her get there, asking her to come back. And when she returns, she finds herself with a double exposure in Mark's head. Incredibly strong work with visual language.
There is so much personal here, so much pain. It's been a long time since I've felt such strong emotions from TV series, probably since the days of "Heirs".
The shot where Mark desperately does not want to open the door to the police, realizing what they will say. And at the same time, Gemma, realizing in despair that she has returned back to the horror floor, is just really, really punchy.
And here there are such warm shades of spring or autumn, flowers, life is in full swing! Nice to see.
And you realize what Lumon did to their lives. He turned it into a personal hell for the autie and arranges death or die trials for the intr.
Gemma remembers Mark, she wants to go to him, she's not a clone! What a relief and at the same time very sad for them that everything is like this. If Hayley gets pregnant now, things will get a lot more complicated. I hope not...
"what is this in very good Russian from Gemma with almost no accent was very surprising (in a good way), despite the fact that there is an explanation for this
In the reproductive clinic, their sign is also on the questionnaire, of course. Not to mention the maniac doctor who works there.
Maybe it's all a tricky multi-pass from the very beginning?
Very beautiful film flashbacks, of course.
And rewind the frames of the happy past to the "Waltz in a thousand quarters" by Jacques Brel
It's a creepy thing, actually-and it's scary that the scriptwriters clearly associate Gemma's story with it.
What kind of expectations do you have to have to write this? x) You give people excellent cinematography, incredible emotions of the actors, riddles, ENT for 50 minutes, finally, and they write black, some information on zeros.
There is more information than in many previous episodes, where the emphasis was on dialogues. They revealed Gemma's character, showed her and GG's past, showed where and what she is now (I haven't seen her all season), how she tries to escape, and showed how Lumen works... Is it too little??? Well, I don't even know. It's full in just 50 minutes, like a full-fledged mini-movie.
But why did they take blood from the overseer when she let Gemma into the room? You can also pile up versions, and so on for each new location/character.
But why are they so similar to the MDR department? Let's say this is from the category of physiognomy, where appearance shapes character, but how to connect it? Should these understudies not make decisions, but only monitor?
And according to sabzh: the series itself and the concept are great, but when the first season just flew in one go and there was no slack, then you expect the same movement from the second season (which, unfortunately, got into production hell).:
When every frame is JUSTIFIED. But, alas and ah, you can safely watch every second episode of the second season on a fast-forward and you won't lose ANYTHING. That's what I'm talking about. That they invest a minimum of information in maximum time.
The dialogues from the previous episodes MOVED the plot, unlike the several-minute scenes of a single frame (corridor, abstract images).
That information, as in a full-fledged mini-movie (which in itself is like a taftology), could be submitted in 15 minutes and not lose anything.
Another interesting point, in the title of the series, is about the picture where a man is struggling with himself and the question "how do we know that this is him?" Gemma talks about the hairstyle. Is this a hint that Mark and Mark are different people? Although I still don't believe in the theory of clones, it sounds a bit ridiculous.
In my opinion, the first series with a warm color scheme. Even Mark's awakening at the end is with her.
And the MDR was 96% decrypted by Cold Harbor, and Gemma had never been in that room before. It turns out that MDR completes the project first, then Gemma can gain experience in the room.
How unusual the separation is, at first it seemed to me that only the elevator separates, then there was a forest, and now it turns out that this technology allows you to create consciousness for several personalities and all this within different rooms. Unbelievable.
Interestingly, Innie is followed by almost copies of the main characters, and they are also absent at the same time when the heroes are not in place. The series gave some answers, showed the story of Mark and Gemma's relationship (I was waiting for this), but brought a lot of new questions.
All departments are interconnected, I think. What MD is doing, I'm sure, is directly related to the Gemma tests. And her innies are being tested for their limits and reactions to what is happening. They are most likely rabbits before the product is released to the masses.
It seems to me that when Mark finishes Cold Harbor and Gemma enters the office, her body will be completely erased, and only a body prepared for any stressful situations will remain, into which someone else's consciousness can be transferred. Well, or something else, but it's bad. So Mark doesn't have to finish the project to save her. But I'm also thinking about what Mark and Helly will do if Gemma is rescued. I feel sorry for their couple. But it looks like we're going to lose someone in the end: either Helly or Gemma.
I think there's probably something about grieving the loss of a child in the cold harbor room? Or maybe Auty Gemma will come in there? And the name of the room appeared recently, because Mark is close to completing work on the file?
Is it unclear what the department is doing with the dark version of MDR? And are they all very similar in appearance to their "colleagues"? Irving 2.0 is still sitting there.. and did they change these people for others when Mark had new colleagues?
Well, Dr. Mauer is definitely some kind of relative of Cyrus, a similar type, it seems to me. Just like the guy with the frolic tattoo.
In general, there are a lot of questions, but the narration "answers" the questions in time, which I find incredibly enjoyable when watching and not understanding what is happening. It's a pity that the next episode will be only 37 minutes long.
Another thought - why choose Gemma? Considering that many people went to Lumon after an accident, it is possible that each victim was monitored for some time, then the accident was set up, and the company tested some of his vital signs. And based on these tests, it turned out that Gemma had the best survival results. That's the whole reason.
Gemma is very sorry, some kind of absolute hopelessness. I don't even see how Mark can get her out of this whole situation yet. Lumon is just a corporation of psychopaths, all the way it was impossible to burn with all these doctors.
I understood the death of Ivan Ilyich Tolstoy by ear. I got it right only from the comments.
Before this episode, Milchek was perceived as an abbreviated "nice person". And he's really really creepy. Like all the unrequited ones in Lumon.
The scenes are very beautifully staged, the professionalism of both the actors is visible (what changes Mark has made!), as well as the directors, cameramen, editors, make-up artists - in general, everyone in every frame. The visual component of this series is simply the best I've seen in a long time.
At the same time, the way the plot unfolds cannot leave anyone indifferent. It's hard and scary. I really want a good ending for Gemma.. But will it be, given the last room?
Jessica Lee Gagné, director of #Severance S2 Ep7, her directorial debut.
There's the shot that goes from MDR to the control room downstairs [via electrical cables]. There's no CGI in it. It's all real.
We actually shot through cables. It was the most laborious thing I have ever done as a DP. It was the biggest side project of this show and so many people participated on it. You should see the rig for it: The camera goes through the internal part of the desk. There's a pulley moving in it.”
1. The doctor who conducts experiments with Gemma was at the fertility clinic. Perhaps it has something to do with trying to produce the perfect man without flaws? Or there was simply a higher chance of finding a woman who wants to forget something in her life and agree to a separation.
2. Offices are subjected to stress and fears. Are they checking if the chip is working? Or are they trying to rid the extras of these fears? The picture that Dylan stole last season, according to Gemma, depicted a struggle with his demons - fears.
3. It seems that the data for processing is the workers themselves, their facial expressions, otherwise why are they constantly monitored in the monitor? But how this is related to what is happening in the rooms is not yet clear at all.
It is obvious that Cold Harbor means death - a special one-time innie so that autie does not have to experience the moment of passing away... Another question is, what is Lumon's idea of what should happen to Autie at this moment? Is he going to die too, or does Lumon have any plans for the surviving part of his consciousness, too? Basically, the search for immortality in one form or another is a pretty logical fixation topic for rich and ultra-rich old people, so I wouldn't be surprised.
And most importantly, of course, what I'm worried about right now is whether Gemma can be saved. not in the form of Miss Casey or anyone else, but the real Gemma herself, is she even capable of living and existing outside the underground floors of Lumon, or as in the Death of Ivan Ilyich, everything will inevitably end up as it was stated from the very beginning?
Thanks to Jessica Lee Gagne for such an amazing, unique series - a phenomenal debut.
When Mark was first shown in the past, I almost choked on my tea - it was so cool. The difference is not only noticeable, it is enormous!
Their love story with Gemma is very beautiful and it was felt even through the screen how sincere and deep their love was, but at the same time I can't help myself and subconsciously root for Mark and Helly /Helena.
At this moment, I feel divided myself, because one part is for Gemma, the other is for two versions of our red-haired beast)
It seems to me that all the rooms Gemma gets into are related to their shared history with Mark.
For example, their acquaintance began with the question Who are you? The dialogue begins with the same question when you get into the Lumon.
Before leaving the house, Gemma tells Mark that she loves him, but he remains silent and she then repeats that she loves him, "oh yes, of course, I love you too," and also in one of the scenes Mark says that she does not like to write thank—you letters - then in one of the rooms she writes the letters and at the end, this "doctor" who is in all the rooms tells Gemma that he loves her and corrects her about her Make. And she says, "I love you too."
The only thing I haven't figured out yet is Wellington's room, where Gemma is at the dentist. There's nothing related to him in Gemma and Mark's story, could it be that they're putting a chip in their teeth in this room? And everyone allows you to enter a new room.
It also seems strange to me that of all the variety of Russian literature, Gemma is mostly about Tolstoy - the Death of Ivan Ilyich, Hadji Murad. It seems that I will join those who will read these works and look for a solution there.
Hadji Murad is between two worlds: loyalty to his people and the need to cooperate with enemies in order to save his family. It seems to me that there is a direct parallel here: to be true to yourself and your principles, or to cooperate with Lumon in order to reunite with Mark and have a family
Hadji Murad is trying to free himself and the people from oppression, and Gemma is also trying to break out of the Limon.
Hadji Murad is confronted by an imperial machine where he is used in political games, and Gemma stands up to a corporation that manipulates her mind, someone else's, and controls the lives of intras and extra employees.
Can the conditions in the rooms originate from the consciousness of the extras? Like I went through X experience, it traumatized me. And I find myself in a room that is programmed to reproduce some kind of negative or sad experience.
as for what they're experiencing... I think they're physically real. Gemma has a sore mouth/ jaw, arm, which means that if she damages anything on the plane, then this injury will remain with her.
to see the incredible directing and cinematography.
In any case, it's annoying how slow the creators are to provide information. The first season was more lively and there was more life for the workers, they had a goal and they were moving towards it. Now they've almost forgotten about the workers on the line, and they don't show it in every episode anymore. But this is the most interesting thing, and that's why we fell in love with the series.
We were shown that Cyrus is a terribly old man (and evil). Maybe he wants to move into a young body?
At the beginning of the episode, we talked about gorges. With strange hints that the gorge is about sex. "I conquered the first gorge in school" and that's it. Cold Harbor is a cold gorge. Cold sex? Cold vag *on? Something about giving birth to the dead or having sex with the dead? In any case. if she is constantly stressed in every room, then there will be final stress. And this is very important for an old billionaire.
And we were shown a little dead bride in one of the previous episodes. Cyrus was masturbating in the woods, and then there was a little dead bride? Who's the little one? Miss Huang? She plays a Russian musical instrument, Gemma is also connected with Russia. They both think that the Lumon staff are talking like crazy. Perhaps Lumon is trying to transfer consciousness into his own young clone? Are Gemma and her clone Miss Huang the test subjects?
Did her father speak ill of Helena? Isn't he the founder of Lumon?
They write that this is a transformation and a search for truth. Transformation is more about Mark, of course. But Gemma is looking for the truth, trying to escape and free herself.
The macro data processing department is engaged in defragmentation of consciousness. The chip in their brains digitizes their memories, which they sort further, or rather their intro. That is why they unconsciously understand where the numbers are scary and where they are not.
Globally, this is an experiment aimed at understanding how much it is possible to rewrite consciousness and get a new personality. The one you choose. Without fears, without complexes, without injuries, etc. More confident, the one who can write with her left hand and generally do anything. I learned it intro, but I use it extra. Lumon achieves stable results.
In general, everything is even simpler. There were no intros from the beginning. The intro is a chip. And the extra simply rents out his body and brain to plant a new personality, which is contained in the chip. In short, I think the theory about the immortal Aegons is correct. They want to learn how to transplant their consciousness.
It turns out that Mark's wife was abducted at the moment when, most likely for the sake of IVF, she fit into a pilot experimental separation test program for pain relief during childbirth. But then a crazy doctor got caught and something went wrong...
This is confirmed by animal tests.
It will be funny if that's the case, because this is essentially the plot of the Cyberpunk 2077 game)
Anyway, this is just my guess. I don't know why the department couldn't finish without Mark... Although why couldn't he, what couldn't he? Everyone is working on their own file. If, for example, Irving's files were named the same as Gemma's rooms, then there would be a question.
It took Mark's chip to be flooded (read: destroyed) in order for his personalities to collapse, respectively, if the chip was destroyed, his intro personality would also be destroyed,
the chip separates it, and I adhere to the version that it separates from bad memories, for example#34;frightening" (first folder on the left), or annoying, or causing grief, sadness, rage, boredom, anger, etc.
But if the goal is so good, why is this project so secret? After all, none of the outsiders knows what exactly they are doing.
But they will remain different Brands.
It's a very interesting series, very intense, but so heavy. And again, how do the actors act out🤌
With just one glance, they can convey the whole essence of a scene.
So far, the separation doesn't make such an impression, it feels like everything is going exactly according to an already thought-out scenario, and everything has a clear explanation, and not just an unusual joke to surprise the viewer, but what it means, we'll figure it out later- just read The comments are here or on Reddit, people have almost covered everything.
It's a bit early to close the series - it has excellent ratings, and this is only the second season (Lost has 6 of them, and the slide did not happen on the second, but later). Let them take off at least three or four.
One of her personalities sits endlessly at the dentist's office, the other endlessly signs silly postcards.... It turns out that she has been subjected to experiments for two years. And only the number of rooms is growing.
And what will happen when she passes Cold Harbor, why will she have to say goodbye?
And the most heartbreaking thing is that the outer Gemma remembers everything.
Just let Mark save her and they'll be happy. 💔
For some reason, it seemed to me that even if Mark found her, she wouldn't remember him or anything from her past life.
It haunts me that Irving knows about the existence of the black elevator for some reason. Previously, we assumed that he was the elevator that took the innies to the test site, where they were rebooted, but in this episode, the idea of the lower floor has changed.
Irving has been working for Lumon for 9 years, and only 3 in the processing department. Where could he have worked before? He is interested in art - could this be an indication of the optics and design department? :) We know from Felicia's words that their employee used to go to the export corridor. Something has happened that the rules have changed.
I would venture to assume that three years ago Irving witnessed what was happening there. That he told his colleagues about it, and the uprising of the optics and design department is not just a rumor. This would also explain their attitude against the handlers: they learned that the handlers - literally - create conditions for torture.
The information on Irving's chip will be erased after that. As an inni employee, he will be transferred to the processing department, but auty (this is where my version is bursting at the seams) must find out about the black elevator from somewhere. Auty goes to the office every day only to leave his zeroed inni inside the corporation as a mole, which Inni himself does not suspect for three years, until Irving comes up with not sleeping.
I also suggest that perhaps Irving's appearance served as an impetus for Petey's reintegration. Something must have happened before he made that decision, right? "What if we kill people there for 8 hours a day?They actually kill people for 8 hours a day, and Peter knows this when he turns to Mark, but this knowledge could not have been obtained by him only because of the reintegration process, because his innie has no information about the black elevator.
Here... Something like that))
The fact that Irving was attracted to Bert may indicate a previous acquaintance (or Bert was digging under him to understand that Inni Irving knows). And Bert is from optics, which is also relevant for any of the options (they crossed paths there earlier, or Bert appears as an employee of this department to check at the same time if Irving remembers anything when contacting the department).
In any case, the series turned out to be very interesting and informative) Finally, at least some things about Gemma became clear.
, I'm shocked what they're doing to her.
Gemma's pair with Mark looks so perfect. An amazing series, every second and every frame. This is the level that I want to see in all series. How to give it infinity instead of 5 stars..
ie
, a red dress is a pain in the mouth
The blue airplane Dress
The red robe is Christmas.
That's why when she saw the red dress, she said "damn" because she realized what was waiting for her today.
Thus causing not only physical discomfort, but also an associative series.
There is a feeling that she voluntarily agreed to this experiment, because she urgently said "I want to go home" as if SHE could decide when it was time for her to leave, or at least she was given such hope that when she said she would be released.
And what if they stress her inni in order to check whether the consciousness will switch to the Present in extreme conditions that can occur in ordinary life, after which they will replace the extended consciousness with any other and will be sure that under no circumstances will there be a malfunction ... but then why Gemma and if the separation works successfully What 's the problem with women in labor ?
By the way, I wonder how many offices there are. She doesn't have enough teeth to pick at them every day. And the next day, she won't be able to write with her left hand because of the pain for at least a week. And even if she wrote often, she would already write easily with her left hand.
Therefore, it seems to me that, first of all, not all cabinets are connected specifically with her experiences. And there are a lot of offices there, if 4 people per quarter were closed according to the project, then it turns out in 2 years about 32. How many innies does she have then? And maybe she's not the only one there. Because the wall of smiles in season 1 shows how many people Lumon has already made happy.
Secondly, they are probably working to ensure that one person has a lot of innies. But it's not clear why. I would assume that they are making a secret agent for the special services who cannot be cracked - for each legend there is a separate inni under cover who knows nothing about the real person. But this does not fit in with the fact that Cold Harbor will be a breakthrough for all mankind.
the elevator moment is generally a nightmare...is there really no one who would sympathize and help her?
The Macro Data department sorts the numbers that have an emotional connotation, each such project has a name.
Gemma - gets access to the room after the project is completed, i.e. does the macro data department create the separation itself? A new identity?
The macro data processing department completes the project, a new room opens, which Gemma begins to visit, where her new inner self begins to endlessly experience a negative emotion or fear of the original, i.e. extra, as I understood from the comments, these are Gemma's personal fears (dentistry, fear of flying, hatred of Christmas cards).
I have a couple of assumptions, for example, that the Cold Harbor project will be associated with endless death, possibly Gemma's drowning. Because the literal translation of Cold Harbor hints at both drowning in water and death (the name of one of the battles of the American Civil War)
But what, how, for what and why, there are interesting theories in the comments, but I think these are just guesses, in the sense that no one guessed and the creators will present another surprise, perhaps even a plot twist that everyone will be shocked by.
For example, what if Lumen is good? Eh? Well, everyone will be shocked, everyone thinks that Lumen is pure evil.
't read all the comments, so maybe I'm repeating myself.
But
"What kind of dollhouse? There is no dollhouse!"
When Milchik tells Miss Casey to come back, it's the same thing he would say: Shoot yourself, and Gemma's reaction upon returning...😢
And suddenly Mark is shown on the day he meets his wife and he is a normal, handsome young man. Awesome. Why he was made such a freak in the present is not very clear to me.…
It's like you're sitting under a stamp and you don't understand what's going on
I'm just not interested in following these characters.
The end of the first season gave hope that something interesting would begin in the second, but everything returned to stuffy puzzles again, with some kind of dullness.
My grandfather fell in love with my grandfather, and every time he appears, interrupting at least some interesting plot, he is terribly infuriating. I rarely experience this...
The corporation has become a banal sect. The characters, the same Milchik, are caricatured and cause nothing but laughter at all. The actor is good, but I do not know what the director was trying to show with this image of the hero.
The whole series is kind of surreal, covered with puzzles, pretentious speeches, incredibly tedious, every frame of which is stretched to the limit... and with a lot of positive feedback.
It's absurd...
I endured 7 episodes of the second season hoping for a miracle, but eventually dropped this series.
It's impossible to watch it.
It's killing time.
I would like this season to be the last.
1) Can Gemma be innie too? And he released her "into the wild" Lumen to see, for example, if she could socialize? Then they staged an accident to return it?
2) In the scene when Gemma leaves the house on the evening of "death", perhaps she herself went to lumen to "forget" the death of the child, Mark will then follow the same path to forget Gemma's death…
Just like top of the top 🔥
How hair changes the image :)