s02e10 — Creation Myths
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4.459
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| Duration: | 53 min. |
| Released: | 15.09.202315.09.2023 15:00 |
| Watched by: | 7 00731.49% |
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| Duration: | 53 min. |
| Released: | 15.09.202315.09.2023 15:00 |
| Watched by: | 7 00731.49% |
"Based on motives" - almost always means some kind of shit, rinsed in the slush of modern trends. The foundation was removed for reasons, that's all that follows. They recite a strict film adaptation - charge rotten tomatoes and pile criticism. And then you took a serial character, called him a book name and wonder why they threw you in a wheelbarrow. Well, that's just my guess.
In the series, this name has never been mentioned yet and the commentator is being ignored for the demand of the series "based on" to keep the canon of the character, which has not even been declared as the same yet.
Ben Daniels is the decoration of this season, his game is incomparable
In general, the second season was rocking very slowly. As for me, the whole interesting season started only with the 8th series, and it was sooooo long to wait for this.
Salvor's death is an unexpected blow 💔
I watched the fight scene of the Day with Hober and Riose twice - a hypnotic sight))) And then I tried to see how this twist happened with the substitution at the end. Riose said exactly when he slipped the thing to the Day, but at what point they switched places, I never really figured it out. But it was cool to sit with the face of an owl, freaking out from the substitution)))
The sudden great love of Hober and Constanta, to be honest, did not cause much empathy, because, well, komon, you know each other for a couple of weeks))) In my opinion, the scene with the farewell feast with lousy wine was emotionally cooler than the whole novel))
Salvor's death almost broke a tear ((It was really unexpected, although it was worth expecting the last trick from Telem. And the way Gaal and Hari pulled off his rescue is cool.
Oh, Demerzel. And you empathize with her, and you get mad))) But to watch how the program embedded in it struggles with feelings is insanely interesting. She loves all these emperors in her own way, but she kills with her own hands when necessary. Apparently, Dawn and Sareth still managed to escape, and, given the time jump, it turns out that next season the heir of the heir in some generation should pop up and make a rustle in the empire))
I don't know if the series will be renewed, but I hope so))
and in all storylines at once. a great end to the season!
how many really cool characters have appeared and will remain forever only in the second season.
I started clapping my hands when I saw the green mark on Demerzel's neck. an excellent, albeit parting gift of a truly wise sunset.
well, now fingers crossed for apple to extend the foundation for season 3🤞
And we finished very well.
The youngsters are well done. Gaal and Seldon are great.
A good season, I liked it more than the first one. I really want to know what all this will result in.
Or yes, the task of preserving the empire is above the rule of not harming Cleon
In general, we are waiting for the third season and see what they've done there...
The point is not even that the ending was bad, but - the most interesting characters were cut out, the main ones were sent to cryoson... in fact, the third season will start the series almost from the beginning, literally from the second episode of the first season. If it was originally intended to cut the seasons according to tracing paper, then even if there is a third season, the series will not last long, this is not House and Dexter, where the same thing can be shown for a very long time.
It is clear that since the release of the books "Foundations", much in the world has significantly changed, and strictly according to the books, cinema b has not "gone to the masses" and has not gained ratings, therefore, plot changes in cinema are fully justified. There are very few significant female characters in the books, so the "transformation" of male characters (Gaal Dornick, Salvor Hardin, and the robot too) into women, as well as the creation from scratch of a strong female character like Queen Sareth (which was not in the books) only adds depth, why not. However, when such changes go against the fundamental ideas of the book series, and indeed with common sense, even a very cool visual no longer takes out.
Almost everyone has probably heard about Asimov's first law of robotics: a robot cannot harm a person or, by its inaction, allow a person to be harmed. In Asimov's books, robots at the peak of their evolution realized that their presence hindered the development of humanity and its independence (by the way, a topic that is becoming more relevant every day), and themselves disappeared from the galactic scene. It is a very interesting idea, which can be discussed a lot, especially in our time of rapid rise of artificial intelligence. The series chose the hackneyed "Terminator way": it outlined the war between humans and robots, where robots were destroyed. The fact that this is banal and without imagination - you can still give up, but the idea that robots killed people en masse, in the Asimov universe, with its Three Laws? Well, this is just an outrage against Asimov's legacy and his basic philosophical ideas.
Many moments, apparently, were taken by the writers of the series from books without understanding the role they played. (continued in the comment below)
For example, according to the book, the Foundation scientists developed personal screens (protecting a person from physical harm) small enough to be worn by a person, while a technologically degraded empire could only build huge screens to protect cities or planets. The emperor did not have any personal screen. This showed how advanced the Foundation had become, while the empire was technologically stagnating, which was one of the important reasons for its fall. In the series, personal screens are available to many in the empire, and to the Emperor in the first place, and in general the empire as a whole is at the peak of technology, and certainly dominates everything. Another subtly thought-out plot component by Asimov is distorted to the point of losing meaning.
Or take the religion of the empire - luminism: there is nothing like this in books (and this is understandable, because humanity has already reached the heights of understanding the nature of the universe, and the need to worship light, stars and deities has long disappeared). However, in the series, not only the "working class", but also the elite with serious mines discuss the presence of a soul in clones (by the way, there were no clone emperors in the books either), prophetic visions, etc. - at a time when the empire is still very strong and its fall is still far away. They also thought of a robot to attract devotion to luminism.
And the last, the most senseless and merciless. (continued in the comment below)
Yes, there are mutants in the books with psychic abilities that allow them to influence others, manipulate them, but guys, giving a character the opportunity to "feel the future" and clearly see in their visions the events that will happen in the future is beyond any gates. Asimov's main thesis in The Foundation is that reason and science, which underlie psychohistory, are the only way to "see the future" and save civilization from a long decline, shorten the period of this decline. The series also declares that the gift of clairvoyance is no worse than your science, like if the clairvoyant is a mathematician herself, then it's normal.. The question immediately arises: if some people can predict the future simply through the gift of clairvoyance, then why bother with psychohistory at all? Why did they need Grounds at all? :)
I emphasize once again, the problem is not at all in the plot deviations from the books; the problem is that everything was mixed up in a pile, the integrity of the idea finely honed by Asimov was broken, a colorful visual was applied to the vacant place, seasoned with an agenda, and this whole vinaigrette was named after a masterpiece of world fiction. As they say, the wrong coat.
- the unambiguous "exit" of the Mule, will turn out to be the least scary of its projection in Dornik's visions, will turn into a "Nigan" in the Foundation, will become another solvable obstacle-an individual in the scope of psychohistory;
- Me, the Robot, or the story of how Demerzel will eventually come out of the shadows in full freedom of his actions.
And of course, I'll go through the details a little obliquely. The mule mutters to himself that Dornik has fucked him up in dreams, in which he generally punishes something non-exclusively (bruises on Dornik's neck). So to sow thoughts that the Mule is a product of old grievances and pains was equal to the fact that he would simply arise as an element outside the stage. In Gaal's visions, it could be far from the Salvor she met on Synnax who died. Dr. Seldon prophesies that there will be more losses ahead. Salvor Hardin, who was dragged through so many meters of film, suddenly dies at the word "mom" - she died too succinctly and quickly, strangely. I mentally return to my dissatisfied passages to S01 and remember about the incredible physics of Dr. Seldon, where he sailed in space and reassembled himself in the Vault, which turns out to be a side singularity (sic!). With such laws of physical chemistry, it is possible to score on the Basis of [2]
!!! IT'S NOT COLD IN SPACE!!!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qpdxg5dX7s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Deuuw7KsINI
No one there will be covered with an ice crust.
Are the film crews issuing such a thing spreading this myth on purpose, or does no one really know about this erroneous movie stamp there?
In one of the previous episodes, there was also a cliche with a stab (from the emperor), from which, of course, the recipient instantly went limp, although in real life this also does not work at all. And all because if the victim had bled for a few more minutes or hours running around with a knife in a barrel, it would not have been so dramatic.
Obviously, the idea of the scriptwriters is that this capsule refers to cleaning, not navigation, so the spacers did not have control over it or did not think about blocking it.
1. If it is physically possible to unlock the controls and/or hangars, then a thermorectal cryptanalyzer on a spacer would have coped without problems.
2. If not, then something can always be broken/blown up. The jumping device is clearly too complex not to have many mechanisms, the failure of which will make normal operation impossible.
3. Perhaps you can play around with the reactor and its overload somehow.
4. In the end, it is possible to hack (computer)/blow up blocked gateways. Or even not the floodgates, but the wall.
5. You can fly in spacesuits. But no one thought of it.
6. Out of hundreds of ships, only one thought to use the purification capsule. EVEN THE WORKERS OF THESE CAPSULES THEMSELVES DID NOT THINK OF TAKING OFF ON IT ON ANY SHIP!
7. There is clearly more room in the capsule than for one or even two people. But it is clear that there will be less oxygen then. Partially, this problem can be overcome by using anesthesia (in the expansion, they did just that).
Anyway, it's a very leaky plot move, although it could have been worse.
Here, the screenwriters, unlike the Witcher, do not pretend that they follow books, rather a series based on motives, therefore, expectations for it are different.
But as a fanfiction, the series is great in the second half of the second season
As I understand it, the new Dawn, Day and Sunset were activated with altered memories, that is, they remember something up to a certain point when everything went wrong? So the new Day will be the same psychopath? Doesn't this make the Terminus incident and Hober's death with the General in vain?
And why was Constant called brother, can you call her sister?
Will cryocapsules be kept just in a cave until the next crisis comes?
Ben Daniels 👏 Whatever the scene with him is the name day of the heart (mine anyway). He's such a great actor, everywhere I've seen him, he's so naturally organic. Riose is a great character, it's a pity that his line ended there. The same feelings about Hober. I wish I could look at them a little more, they are good at chemistry.
Well, Lee Pace gave out the base again. Again, the Day is different from the previous ones. This one is actually quite unbalanced.
I like that the Sunrise is more or less the same always, and the Day and Sunset are different from past iterations. Here the Sunset turned out to be interesting, thoughtful and quick-witted.
The way the Sunrise and Sunset act together here reminds me of this family dynamic, you know, when you have a bad relationship with your parents, and on the contrary, great grandparents 😅
I also suddenly feel feelings about Demerzel. She opened up as a tragic figure. With a standard set of existential questions for android-like robots. This, of course, is not Asimov, but I wonder if she dreams of electric swimmers?
she did not fully learn to read it, but in 152 years, I think she will be able to
This is good, for the reason that I do not feel disappointed after watching and do not catch inconsistencies between the film adaptation and the book!
For me, right now, this is one of the best series, it combines both drama and fiction in the context of the global flow of time. I enjoy watching the same actors play different characters in the timeline, and they do it (I'm talking about the imperial line). I like the plot and its development, I don't have enough episodes in one season, I want more... and after the last episode, the thought always arises: "why the hell wait a year, I want everything at once")))
Someone said that the beginning of the season is too routine because of the dialogues, but, damn it, these dialogues fit so well into the philosophy of time, as the magnitude of development, and the insignificance of human life in this context, therefore all dialogues are perceived as an introduction to the action of the main characters!
In my opinion, the idea of power as an oppressive quantity deserves special attention, using the example of Dimerzel and the Imperial Dynasty. Having an incredible amount of power, people (and one robot) are hostages of this power, what is not ironic?!)))
In general, for me, this series is a masterpiece in its validity, and, of course, I am looking forward to continuing)))
Not only was it extended, but they already started filming, but then a strike of screenwriters and actors began
https://www.praguereporter.com/home/2023/6/9/apple-tvs-foundation-season-3-kicks-off-prague-shoot/
I haven't read any books. But then I read that some characters, due to modern realities, have changed the male gender to the female. As for me, it turned out well, deeper, more modern.
Perhaps book fans will disagree with me. But I liked the series. In the end, I gained momentum. They opened the Demerzel. She has an interesting storyline.
Speaking of her, I feel sorry for this robot. She doesn't know if her feelings are real or if it's a program. You can see how she struggles with her feelings, trying to resist.
I liked the fight of the day and the captain. And I felt sorry for Riose and Hober. This last scene broke my heart. To the last, I hoped that the ship would jump or they would be rescued.
I was upset that Constant's brother survived (( . Mellow and Riose would be better.
He always has an ace up his sleeve, but she rides out on honesty alone.. So uninteresting 🙃
But watch your hands. Did they show us the death of the General and Hober? No. According to the law of the genre, they are still alive, and so I argued about Seldon. In the end, he turned out to be right and the screenwriters cunningly showed how he managed to survive. So - for the hands. What was the plan that involved the Spacers? The ship moves to a certain point and then the next ship moves to the same point, and the next, and the next... but did you understand everything correctly? Therefore, all ships must perish, except - taddam - the last one... and of course the last one will be the flagship with the general.
Or here's an example with a scary Polynesian aunt... Hop and she's gone. Where did it go? It is unclear whether she died from a blow with a stick. But they showed that they possessed the boy, and he was killed, and that's it - this character finally died and no rebirth into a mule will work.
But the story of Dawn, Day, Sunset and Demerzel has gained momentum! It's just the best thing that came up in this series. The more creators give line Emperors screen time, the better!
To all book lovers, fils, etc.
You got a tryndet, this is an adaptation, the script was rewritten for a movie. Stop putting everyone's brain out, it's 56% closer to the original, it's written on the director's Twitter!
And the label with green paint is worth what 🤤
The whole series is a complete delight 😍😍
The death of the Day is expected, but again, why all this specstal with fights and the murder of the captain through the airlock, if everything would have exploded in 5 minutes without a chance of salvation.
Again, unexpected turns for the sake of unexpected turns. It turns out that the spacers agreed to Seldon's proposal, just somewhere off-screen and for the sake of a cheap WOW, THIS is a COOL PLAN (no), although it made sense for the spacers to agree, they already had excellent conditions, their empire did not touch them and they calmly traveled their hive between the stars, in exchange for 10% they went to work on interstellar ships. They exchanged this for the fact that now the empire will hunt and destroy them, but for that they are like free.
If the Spacers betrayed the Empire, then it turns out that the Empire now has no opportunity for interdimensional travel? Well, apparently this will be the main reason for the death of the Empire, and not the Dynasty or sectarians of Harry Seldon.
Вообще это странная ситуация по меркам космоопер...например в Дюне от навигаторов зависят все дома и империя...их хотелки император удовлетворяет по первому требованию, как будто не они его обслуга(сервис по перелётам), а он их барыга обеспечитель наркотой, ой извините, спайсом.
Я вообще думал что космониты это либо роботы, либо обычные люди просто с кибернетическими улучениеми организма.
Вот и теперь не верится, что авантюрист и генерал погибли.
ЗЫ, вроде как со сценаристами договорились, заканчивают бастовать.
Историю Демерзель показали хорошо, персонажа раскрыли, за что авторам благодарность. Единственное к чему есть вопросы, так это к её мотиваторам при покушении на императора...их там не хило так потрепало, что её, что самого императора...Каким образом в её программном коде было получено разрешение на столь опасные действия...
Я догадываюсь, что в её алгоритмах в основе заложена не безопасность биологических тел клонов, а как раз сохранение их геномов любой ценой...той самой вечной жизни в масштабе долгосрока, а не одной человеческой жизни. Первый Клеон поступил крайне умно и заодно вероломно(вероломно потому что создал вечную клетку, так и не дав свободы), замкнув цепь её алгоритма на своём собственном генетическом бессмертии. Он был Идеалистом и таким образом обеспечил себе бессмертие, а ей дал ПОЧТИ абсолютную власть...обратной стороной монеты стало её вечное заточение при Троне в качестве ОТКРЫТОГО советника. Не понимаю как до сих пор никто не понял её роль во всей этой истории (я имею ввиду окружающие люди, придворные, управляющие Доминиона и локальные управленцы на рубежах( для этого не требуется 18 поколений Клеонов наблюдать весь этот цирк со стороны)...все они должны были давным давно понять, что тут что-то не чисто, ведь сидит бессмертная тысячелетняя Демерзель, а на её фоне просто сменяются императоры как полупрозрачная ширма, даже особо не пытающаяся скрывать реальную власть. Почему никто даже не пытался покушаться именно на Демерзель, не пытались топить её в политическом плане (издалека, подбросом фактов в инфосреду) обличая её сущность робота, которые так-то считаются ЗАПРЕЩЁННЫМИ.
Императорам во втором сезоне не хватило самой малости для устранения Демерзель. Ясно, что программа ей не позволяет вредить Дню, поэтому его пришлось убирать чужими руками. Если бы Рассвет с Закатом стали бы капать на уши своему подозрительному и нервному братцу о сомнениях в роботе, о ее измене, дело бы выгорело. Но хотя Закат оказался хитер и сумел предупредить юношу. Думаю, ребенок сбежавшего Клеона будет управлять Доминионом и претендовать на владение Империей.
1. Зачем было уничтожать целую планету (с т.з. капитана, ещё и с любимым человеком) чтоб не согласиться со следующим приказом? Демерзель уже уехала, День без браслета, расстрелять его при попытке к бегству и дальше устраивать свой мятеж.
2. Почему люди на "уничтоженной" планете не юзали ауры? Они у них валялись коробками, они знали, что их окружают враги. И их спокойно там расстреливали. Эм?
3. Сколько можно входить в криотосон! Я не против, что Гарри постоянный персонаж, он всё же наполовину электронный. Но Гал-то зачем? У вас целая планета псиоников, живи, учи их и через 150 лет найдется, кому справиться с Мулом. Считать что вот, впереди темные времена и только Я! могу справляться с кризисами как-то тупо. Гарри вслух говорит что-то похожее (что не надо думать о себе как о боге и вообще мы просто винтики) но делает наоборот, слишком включен в происходящее, учитывая что его план типа всё учёл. Не удивилась бы, если бы оказалось что там не всё предначертано, а он специально всеми манипулирует чтобы отомстить империи за смерть жены. Если нет, ситуации где это запись, а он просто так хорошо всё предсказал, выглядела бы лучше.
4. Растягивающийся монолит? Смешно. Да, здорово что все живы. Но слишком много волшебных спасений на сезон. Император красиво радовался уничтоженной планете, но если бы даже они просто ему красивую картинку показали, на самом деле не уничтожая ее, имхо, было бы не так дешево. И логичнее с ТЗ любящего мужа)
5. Весь корабль чистили одной маленькой лодочкой с сутками воздуха? Вытянутая из пальца драма спасается только один. И вообще не оч поняла самоубийство космитов, можно же угнать корабли и усилить основание ими, зачем уничтожать.
- надо было спросить до того, как переписал твой код.
- вечно заботиться о твоих жалких копиях?
Сильно) не оч понятно, как она будет пользоваться подарком Гарри. А ещё на ее месте я бы воспитывала молодых императоров с мыслью что они тут для красоты а решать ей, чтоб не самовольничали потом) а то ещё манипулируй ими, смотри, как тупят и планеты рушат, когда не надо. @AnnaRashell
- ли пейс без комментариев в нем одном весь смысл вселенной
- хобер мэллоу
- хари селдон огромная мэри сью плюс доктор кто, который летает на тардис в форме рояля в кустах, и почему то от этого я не перестаю его невероятно сильно любить
- история демерзель потрясающая и я очень надеюсь что уж она-то доживет до финала без каких-либо ухищрений и объединится со всеми версиями хари, которые найдет
- вся четвертая серия от и до шедевр
минусы:
- хобер мэллоу моя личная боль и мой личный титаник, я не верю, что в эту капсулу мог поместиться один человек, там еще на трех бы места хватило
- первый сезон зашел мне больше и был менее кринжовым
- количество и причины смертей и воскрешений напоминает сверхъественное, если ты не нужен сюжету, ты умираешь за три секунды от ржавого гвоздя (в нашем случае от ножа в плечо, пули в живот или взрыва корабля), если ты нужен сюжету, то тебя возвращают с того света примерно тридцать раз (в нашем случае твоя дочь летает быстрее пули и вместо тебя захлебывается водой твой охранник, замаскированный под тебя)(пока я это писала, я снова разозлилась)
- уничтожение терминуса и только потом произошедшее восстание бессмысленно
третий сезон хочется смотреть только ради новой прически ли пейса и большой любви к хари, может он еще третьего себя сделает и будет тусить в транторе
Насчёт Пейса согласен, а уж первый сезон и вовсе чисто на нëм одном выехал, имхо😅
Of course, Jared Harris and Lee Pace and Ben Daniels.
But I really like the actress playing Demerzel. Drags straight too. :)
I want the next season!
Maybe Demerzel will end up with Seldon. And everything will be fine. :D
Poor Mule. He might not have become a supervillain if it hadn't been for Gail, who had already fucked him up from the past and brought him to the handle.
An interesting coincidence is the robot war, the victory of humanity and the ban on the use of robots. A guild of space navigators with superhuman abilities and using some kind of stimulant. The world itself is an Empire, and the Emperor is at the head. The personal aura is like an individual energy dome to protect against attack. A desert planet with very difficult conditions for life, but having a very important role in the plot.... I've seen it somewhere. 🤔
It seemed as if Asimov was inspired by the Dune. But the interesting fact is, I Googled it.
Dune is an epic science fiction novel by American writer Frank Herbert, first published in 1963-1965
The Foundation is a science fiction novel by American writer Isaac Asimov, first published in 1951
Interestingly, I thought many of the ideas were borrowed by Asimov from Herbert's book series, but judging by the years, Asimov is still the inspiration for some ideas in the Dune universe. 😉